| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Pasty7 |
Posted - 02/13/2011 : 15:51:00
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=353743
I'm Glad Mario had this to say about the direction of the league toward disciplin he is absolutly right when saying the Islander vs,. Penguins game was a travesity not even to mention the all the cheap shot and dangerous hits going on in today's NHL maybe coming from Mario the league will perk up and listen!
"I led the league in "Go get 'em next time." - Bob Uecker
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| 24 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Utemin |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 20:34:55
I read this article before you posted it, i decided it was not worth a topic because it is a bunch of bs...
Don't hate me because i'm Beautiful |
| Thrasher |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 17:12:39
Mario, since I was the one who brought up Karma, i will give you more ammo against me . I didn't mean so much as other players on the Pens deserve to be hurt, and I used the wrong choice of words. But for Mario to come out and slam the Islanders for the "travesty and disgrace" is garbage. Cooke may bring some skill, I am not arguing, but the guy is a loose cannon with ZERO respect for anyone else. I dislike Ovechkin for much of the same reasons I dislike Cooke (questionable hits, over agressive play that may be dangerous to other players), but in my mind there is a HUGE leap from Ovechkin to Cooke. Cooke is a repeat.... how many times i don't know. And now Mario is whining to the league and not wanting to be apart in it? I would love to see a poll of the league players to see who is the most hated player. I can't promise anything obviously, but i would stick a fat wad of cash on Cooke.
I get that your a Penguins fan and all. But when I saw Antons Elbow about a week ago, I still thought that was absolute trash and he should have been suspended longer. And here the Devils are finally starting to play proper hockey...
Its not that i think the teammates of Cooke deserve to pay for what he does. It was more directed at Mario taking a serious look at his lineup. And anyone that doesn't believe he could request Shero to trade Cooke.... Well theres just no helping you
I Promise I didn't give her the STD, I'm not a sharing person. |
| The Duke |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 16:43:44
Toxx i agree that all of Cookes actions are premeditated....while yes true, maybe not dwelling on 1 particular player, but all players in general. He is a bad one for sure.
I`m surprised that there wasn`t more said on Crosby`s head-shot. Looking at the replay, ( forget who it was on Wash., the first head - shot ) he skated a 10 - 15 feet slowly towards Crosby before raising his elbow and delivering the blow to Crosby`s head. It was a really, really delayed head - shot, which i think is the worst kind, he had plenty of time to think about what he was doing. It was not a in action....re-action type of hit.
Mario....i think Gretzky suffered just as much abuse playing hockey as did Mario Lemieux....the biggest difference being Gretzky took it and moved on, Lemieux constantly bitched about it on a nightly basis, thats why Gretzky is much more of a favorite player of mine. |
| Guest0032 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 15:46:40
Interesting take on the game by Konopka
http://www.torontosun.com/sports/hockey/2011/02/14/17273606.html
I'm not saying he's right by any degree, but an empassioned look from the other side of the argument. That's uncensored commentary you usually don't hear from professional athletes. |
| Mario 66 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 15:42:14
Beans i am in agreement that the heymaker from behind was eerily similar to the Bertuzzi one but you probably will not get many people agree with you simply because after the shot talbot fell to the ice and was not forced to the ice like Bertuzzi. I am in complete agreement with you however; i just forsee others coming up with different scenario's such as the outcome that you mention to lead it in a different direction / arguement
Lemieux owns Gretzky |
| ToXXiK1 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 15:36:10
No worries Mario, but i did start if off.... things I read. |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 14:16:52
Again, maybe not the popular opinion, but does anyone else see a disgusting comparison to the Bertuzzi/Moore incident to the sucker punch thrown by the Islander player?? The only difference in my opinion is that Moore never played again. However, it should be irrelevant.
A perfect example of the NHL punishing the outcome and not the action. As long as this continues to be the status quo, these incident(even though they are few and far between) will continue to happen.
If Bettman and his leadership team deserve to be punted from power, it is for their lack of ability to control the on ice product based on their feeble and inconsistent discipline.
Punish the action severely and consistently. Punish further based on the outcome. |
| Mario 66 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 12:27:09
My bad Toxxik thought those where your add on's at the end and therefore you can ignore the karma as the comment was relatated on Dreger's blog. As stated not all comments where indictive of what i thought where your words. Some posts i've seen on here lately have gone a bit overboard in regards to people's livelyhood & there well being.
Lemieux owns Gretzky |
| Guest2712 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 12:04:03
the hit Gilles threw is similar to what Cooke does. however, what Gilles did afterwards is not! punching a defenceless player who's still in a daze because of the hit he just obsorbed is disgusting! perhaps that is where Mario's rant is stemming from? |
| n/a |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 11:24:47
Yeah, the NHL will have to think long and very hard on any kind of discipline it chooses to dole out against Lemieux and the Pens for his comments.
It is pretty serious when a guy liek Lemieux comes out and slams the league, then says that going forward he might have to re-think his association with the NHL. It is a huge wake-up call for the NHL BOG, Gary Bettman and Colin Campbell, and they better take notice.
Lemieux has a ton of respect and pull with the players . . . if the league decides to play hardball, it could be the start of a war.
I would love to hear from the former players who are now management pipe up - Nieuwendyk, Yzerman in particular, as they had a long history with the Players Association. Because only with a strong, united effort will they be able to force Campbell out, or get the BOG / Bettman to change things.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
| Guest4803 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 10:55:10
Hmmm wonder if Super Mario will be disciplined for his harsh words, seem to remember Dean Lombardi getting a pretty nice fine for attacking the legitmacy of the league. |
| ToXXiK1 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 10:10:06
I didn't make the coments, it's off of Dreger's report, not mine.
The point i was making mostly was to Mario not showing up at meeting to change these things and the fact that his team leads in both catagories, not true?
"Where you not someone who thought cooke should of recieved worse but now are condoning something much more malicious do to the pens willingness ...."
And, if you'd care to have read another of my posts, I completely hung Paille of the Bruins for his same crap that Cooke pulled on Savard.
"Also, since Karma appears to be your motive of the not so helpless victim comment ...."
Karma? where did I say this? Please don't put words into my mouth.
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| Mario 66 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 10:02:02
Toxxik i was on board with you until the the attempted bolded jabs at the end. What does a teams toughness have to do with a guy recieving a blind side sucker punch??? The pens are one of the smaller teams in the league and still throw their weight around and battle more frequently then anyone else. As a coach & fan is that not what you want out of your team an all out full throttle type effort game in an out?
Lets be real the melay obviously began because Johnson knocked Dipietro's head off the prior game, nothing illegal or malicious about it as you say about fighting both combatants where on board.
Just so where on the same pg with your comments you are saying due to the fact the Pens hit and fight alot all be it in the context of the game that one of their players should be allowed to be taken advantage of? Where you not someone who thought cooke should of recieved worse but now are condoning something much more malicious do to the pens willingness to engage in physical contact? Also, since Karma appears to be your motive of the not so helpless victim comment then you must feel Steve Moore deserved to have his neck broke and to have his career ended due to the fact he inadvertently concussed Naslund correct? As such any such punishment to follow (broken neck) shall be condoned?? Players deserved to be hurt and their livelyhood ended because of the way there team plays hockey or one incident?? Is that really a mentality you would raise children with, preach to younger siblings or preach to a minor league team you may aspire to coach in the future??
As i said i was on board until you made the helpless victim comment as no one has the right to end another individuals means of providing regardless of prior actions that you may percieve fit.
I get that verbal responses are based solely on emotions at the time of posting or your viewpoint of a player from past experiences but you think we could use some rationale & integrity (put ourselves in their situation) before we feel the need to approve someone having their heads removed
(Not attempting to slay or just pointing this out solely to you Toxxik but i have seen lately on hear guys encouraging or condoning injuries due to Karma and other such non sense)
Lemieux owns Gretzky |
| ToXXiK1 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 08:54:07
I've highlighted some interesting words:
Mario Lemieux's Sunday rant caught most by surprise. But those close to Lemieux say he was deeply offended by Friday's Penguins-Islanders debacle.
Lemieux chastised the league for failing to discipline the Islanders more severely for their part in a game Lemieux described as a "travesty" and a "sideshow."
"The NHL had a chance to send a clear and strong message that those kinds of actions are unacceptable and embarrassing to the sport," he stated. "It failed."
Lemieux didn't specify in his released statement how the NHL failed, though sources say his frustration is principally focused on the four-game suspension Isles rookie Matt Martin was assessed for his blindside attack on Pittsburgh's Max Talbot.
It's believed Lemieux and the Penguins, like many around the game, see similarities in Martin's actions to Todd Bertuzzi's attack on Colorado's Steve Moore in March of 2004. Moore suffered a concussion and broken neck, while Bertuzzi was suspended for the remainder of the regular season and playoffs.
Moore hasn't played since. By contrast, Talbot escaped injury in the Martin attack.
There is evidence that some players may also think the Martin punishment is considerably light.
"He should be gone for the year," said one player in an unsolicited text to The Dreger Report.
Lemieux's final blow - perhaps the most damning - drives home the depth of his anger as he questions his desire to be involved with the league moving forward.
"If the events relating to Friday night reflect the state of the league, I need to re-think whether I want to be a part of it," he stated.
Fellow NHL owners or governors won't go on the record, but some question the legitimacy of Lemieux's criticism - if only because he is seldom, if ever at league meetings or involved in discussions on league improvements. Some view his statement as "self-serving" and others are growing more disillusioned by the state of the New York Islanders.
While Friday's gong show had more of an ugliness to it than last week's showdown between the Montreal Canadiens and Boston Bruins, let's be careful not to paint the Pens as helpless victims since they have been more than willing combatants this season.
Pittsburgh leads the National Hockey League in fighting majors with 61, six more than Boston and St Louis.
The Penguins average 19.2 penalty minutes per game and are the most penalized team in the NHL.
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| ToXXiK1 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 08:44:11
Fighting and headhunting are 2 different animals. Fighting is between 2 willing combatants, not usually your "upper echelon" players. Only one guy has an opportunity in the headhunting dept. And ya, same rules for EVERYONE. |
| Mario 66 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 08:20:17
I am actually surprised it took Lemieux this long to come out about the state of the game as throughout his career there was never a star player continually recieve the abuse / cheapshots that he did.
Would Cooke be playing regular minutes plus special teams on a team that is arguably top 4 in the nhl if he brought no skill set to the table? Its not like the pens are looking for players to just take up icetime / fill spots. Cooke has been a regular on the second line with malkin for the last 3yrs and is the number one pair on the pk unit with Staal on a regular basis. Not to mention his last 3 teams have been the Pens, Caps, & Canucks all whom aren't exactly in need of talentless goons who bring nothing to the game as they are all high skill set teams.
By no means do i respect or condone the acts that Cooke tends to do from time to time but to label him as a talentless predator is quite undermining of a player who actually possess a skill set far beyond that of those who only see his highlights of stupidity on TSN give him credit for. Thus, his extended career in the league and longevity on solid teams. However; i do ask if cooke is simply the predator / moron some of you make him out to be then does that make those of you who condone a player getting injured because they play with matt cooke a verbal predator who sees karma as a righteous act? The word is mens rea for those who where looking for the legal jargin of a guilty mind which your tirades show you have in making your comments. So, with karma on your mind do you feel that greats such as Gretzky, Lemieux, Messier, Jagr & Francis etc should all be parapalegics right now because they played with stick swinging knee throwing tools like Ulf Samuelson and Marty Macsorely who ruined the careers of many? Better yet we should have Ovechkin, Crosby, Malkin & the Sedins all taken out because they played with Cooke just so Karma is not out of wack right? Or am i now sounding as ostentatious as those of you who think Karma is a B**CH and you get what you deserve
Lets not forget there is indeed no place in the game for the stupidity and complete lack of regard for human safety that Cooke showed last week & Gillies showed the other night. However; it is us as fans, media & the upper echelon of the nhl who have supported the unnecessary fighting between two guys who have no other impact on a game or the media glorifying the fighting / stupidity that has allowed such disregard to continue on. Remember for every Avery / Cooke that we throw under the bus for their stupidity while playing on the edge there is a Ovechkin / Gordie Howe / Bobby Clarke who are given a pass due to their skill set in the occasional situations where they to show little regard for their fellow players.
Lemieux owns Gretzky |
| ToXXiK1 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 05:48:03
"Cooke just skate around waiting for a player any player to be exposed"
pre·med·i·ta·tion (pr-md-tshn)
n.
1. The act of speculating, arranging, or plotting in advance.
2. Law The contemplation of a crime well enough in advance to show deliberate intent to commit the crime; forethought.
How can this not be considered premeditated? Just because he doesn't have a player in mind, by your own statement, he always looking for it? |
| Pasty7 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 05:35:17
I agree with Bean and Sozo on this, Cooke i jut programed on the ice to exploit a player in a vuneralbe position its almost like it's in his nature. Is he dirty is he a scumbag would i be happy if he was uspended from the NHL indeffinetly. The point is Cooke (most likling and seems to me ) doesn't sit on the bench and say ok i'm gonna take Savard's head off and then throw a knee at Ovetchkin,, Cooke just skate around waiting for a player any player to be exposed, The Islanders were going after revenge they knew it going in, Cooke is an equal oppurtunity dirt bag.
Furthur more Mario is the CO- Owner not the GM and as a lot of Owners do they do not get to involved undermining their GM especially a Gm who has won you a Stanly cup and been a serious contender every year , i doubt Cooke is Mario's favorite player but Cooke being a pen is not Mario's call
"I led the league in "Go get 'em next time." - Bob Uecker
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| ToXXiK1 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 04:33:37
quote:
Originally posted by slozo
He can say it was premeditated because it's bleeding obvious it was. Cripes.
Good on Mario for doing this. The league management, and by extension the players union, they are the ones that need to clean up the doling out of suspensions and dicipline. Most of the teams have dirty players, and besides, when headhunting is condoned as it is now, a player doesn't have to be "dirty" per se . . . as it is a normal and accepted practice. So no, I don't see a double standard applied here re: Matt Cooke. MUst be a full moon, because I agree with everything Beans said 
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
I was referring to Beans stating Cooke's not premeditating? |
| n/a |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 04:18:27
He can say it was premeditated because it's bleeding obvious it was. Cripes.
Good on Mario for doing this. The league management, and by extension the players union, they are the ones that need to clean up the doling out of suspensions and dicipline. Most of the teams have dirty players, and besides, when headhunting is condoned as it is now, a player doesn't have to be "dirty" per se . . . as it is a normal and accepted practice. So no, I don't see a double standard applied here re: Matt Cooke. MUst be a full moon, because I agree with everything Beans said
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
| ToXXiK1 |
Posted - 02/14/2011 : 02:35:29
How can you say it's not premeditated? You friends or something? Regardless, Mario still needs to clean up his own backyard, premeditated or not. |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 02/13/2011 : 21:36:35
This is a sensative comment to make as there is nothing I am saying that condones the actions of Matt Cooke. He is a complete dirty bag. However, Cooke is an equal opportunity dirty bag. He does not start a game with a specific player in mind to goon or a specific action to bend and break the rules. He makes stupid decisions, but they are during play and not premeditated. Predatory, but not premeditated.
This Islanders team was out for blood. That is the part that Mario (IMO) was talking about and I agree with him completely.
Deal with players like Cooke on an one on one basis. But when an entire team is headhunting, it crosses a line that the NHL needs to deal with more severely than it did in this case. |
| The Duke |
Posted - 02/13/2011 : 17:10:38
I agree fully Threasher, Cooke is definitely top 3 in the NHL right now when it comes to dirt bag hockey.
As long as a player like Cooke is dishing this stuff out, some other player on his team will receive a cheap shot in return for Cookes actions, happens all the time. |
| Thrasher |
Posted - 02/13/2011 : 16:11:14
I have a hard time sympathizing for Mario and the penguins. Get Matt Cooke off your team before you comment anything about disgrace to the league. I can't think of a dirtier player then him in the league right now. What the Islanders did during that game was garbage and uncalled for, but as long as Cooke is on your team, Karma can be a bi.....
I Promise I didn't give her the STD, I'm not a sharing person. |
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