| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| irvine |
Posted - 03/14/2009 : 18:44:06
It has finally happened, Martin Brodeur (arguably the #1 current goaltender in the NHL,) has tied Patrick Roy's all time Wins at 551.
It's great to see.
Irvine |
| 21 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| just1n |
Posted - 03/19/2009 : 10:53:40
Yeah it's kinda fun to look through the old drafts to see who got picked when. Hindsight is 20/20! |
| n/a |
Posted - 03/18/2009 : 14:21:01
Just1n - Good point about the shootout padding the win (and loss) stats for goalies . . . although it's only been the last few seasons for Brodeur, so in the length of his career, not too statistically significant. But moving forward and looking at future possibilities for HOF goalies like Luongo, Lundqvist and Kiprusoff, it sure will make a difference when half or more of their stats are padded in this way.
And to your link about the year Brodeur was drafted . . . holy crap! Jagr, Tkachuk, Nedved, etc then Brodeur taken 20th. The LEafs could have had him! Argh! But then again, if he had even one bad season, he would've been traded . . . 
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
| Old Dawg |
Posted - 03/18/2009 : 13:28:53
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Taking nothing away from Broduer, but I wanted to drop a bit more on my point of the best goalie ever.
Brodeur has a record of 95-74 in 169 playoff games (.562 win %), 22 shutouts, and 1.96 GAA. Roy, on the other hand has a record of 151-94 in 247 playoff games (.611) 23 shut outs , and a 2.30 GAA.
When looking at this, one has to consider that a goalie needs 4 wins to take any series and 4 losses to lose a series. Broduer's 95 playoff wins means he has won 24(ish) series and his 74 losses means he has lost 18 series. So, of a total he has won 24 of 42 series, or a little less than 50%.
Roy on the other hand, won 38 playoff series and lost 23. Roy won 38 of 61 series or a little more than 60%.
Simply put, in their careers, Roy won more playoff series and a higher percentage of playoff series. Couple this with the fact that none of the Canadiens teams he played on were anything more than slightly above average, Roy is the man. I don't think Broduer has really had a weak team in New Jersey and most of them would be considered one of the top 10 teams in the league each year.
Your calculation are abit
24 of 42 is more than 50% it is more like 57% for Brodeur
38 of 61 is 62% for Roy
Both goalies have been world class competitors.
My congratulations goes out to Marty for the record has broke and the future Shutout record if not this year for sure next year. He will probably end his career with close to 700 wins if he stays healthy for 3 or 4 more years. |
| just1n |
Posted - 03/18/2009 : 11:17:17
All the record setting winning and losing streaks lately are caused by the shootout - no more ties. Kind of takes away from all these new records. Even if we had ties, I'm sure Brodeur would have broken Roy's record eventually though. I prefer shootouts over tie games for sure tho!
Brodeur was drafted 20th overall in 1990. Interesting to see who was picked before him...
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl1990e.html |
| Guest4485 |
Posted - 03/18/2009 : 10:43:39
your math is off beans... 24 of 42 is not less then 50% |
| Axey |
Posted - 03/18/2009 : 09:53:31
Any one notice the irony of him breaking the record on "St. Patrick's Day"?
St. Patrick's Day .. St. Marty's Day .. was a sign in the crowd. Haha |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 03/18/2009 : 08:43:31
Taking nothing away from Broduer, but I wanted to drop a bit more on my point of the best goalie ever.
Brodeur has a record of 95-74 in 169 playoff games (.562 win %), 22 shutouts, and 1.96 GAA. Roy, on the other hand has a record of 151-94 in 247 playoff games (.611) 23 shut outs , and a 2.30 GAA.
When looking at this, one has to consider that a goalie needs 4 wins to take any series and 4 losses to lose a series. Broduer's 95 playoff wins means he has won 24(ish) series and his 74 losses means he has lost 18 series. So, of a total he has won 24 of 42 series, or a little less than 50%.
Roy on the other hand, won 38 playoff series and lost 23. Roy won 38 of 61 series or a little more than 60%.
Simply put, in their careers, Roy won more playoff series and a higher percentage of playoff series. Couple this with the fact that none of the Canadiens teams he played on were anything more than slightly above average, Roy is the man. I don't think Broduer has really had a weak team in New Jersey and most of them would be considered one of the top 10 teams in the league each year. |
| n/a |
Posted - 03/18/2009 : 05:22:22
I agree with Beans wholeheartedly on this one - not the biggest of deals, and of course we as fans are looking at it with a microscope and trying to read into everything, because we truly don't know these guys in real life.
Thinking about well after the fact, it was indeed classy for Roy to be there in Montreal, to witness the inevitable, and must have been personally very difficult to watch.
Kudos on Brodeur being the all-time leader in wins, he deserves it. I'll still take Roy over Brodeur as the goalie I'd pick to have in my net in a must-win game at peak value; but it's splitting hairs at this point, and Brodeur still has lots of game left in him to convince me otherwise . . .
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
| Guest0474 |
Posted - 03/17/2009 : 18:06:45
I'm pretty sure I seen Roy clap, the camera angle sucked and there were people in front of him. Hardly an accusation to take to court as far as Roy not clapping considering 2 seconds of obstructed video evidence. |
| irvine |
Posted - 03/17/2009 : 16:53:16
I never tryed to create something out of nothing. The fact is, he never clapped. Correct, it's nothing. But nothing was to be created out of it. I simply pointed out what could already be seen.
quote:
Originally posted by Odin
Exactly Beans, if he truly wanted to be classless, he would not have even shown up.
People love to try and create something out of nothing. What was he supposed to do? Jump for joy? Not likely. Just because he didn't clap? Maybe he just isn't a rah-rah type of guy.
Alex, I disagree on one point. I don't actually see Brodeur retiring anytime soon. If anything, the way he has come back from the injury just goes to show that he still has a lot of hockey left in him.
Irvine |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 03/17/2009 : 14:17:12
If it's makes any difference, Broduer ended up getting married to his first wife's sister so it's not like it's a horrible thing. Maybe he just happened to fall in love with the woman. I bet it makes family reunions a bit uncomfortable.
My point behind it was that if you want to talk about a player like Roy and his off ice issues, one can not ignore issues of players when comparing the two. It's just unfair.
I say good for Broduer and his record breaking career to this point. Good for Roy for being more gracious than others might be.
But in the end, records are only part of the store. For example, Ray Bourque has the record for most points by a defensemen in league history. However, it is Bobby Orr who is the best offensive defensemen in history (among other things.) That being said, Roy (in my opinion) is still the best and most clutch goalie who ever played the game. |
| Matt_Roberts85 |
Posted - 03/17/2009 : 12:39:51
Brodeur banged his wifes sister? lol, he really is a 'Devil' isn't he? And a quebecer.
There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E". |
| Odin |
Posted - 03/17/2009 : 10:56:12
Exactly Beans, if he truly wanted to be classless, he would not have even shown up.
People love to try and create something out of nothing. What was he supposed to do? Jump for joy? Not likely. Just because he didn't clap? Maybe he just isn't a rah-rah type of guy.
Alex, I disagree on one point. I don't actually see Brodeur retiring anytime soon. If anything, the way he has come back from the injury just goes to show that he still has a lot of hockey left in him.
|
| Alex |
Posted - 03/15/2009 : 10:41:33
Come on guys. Every single one of us would be annoyed that such a great record was broken. Especially because you sit by helplessly knowing that the guy that took it over for you will continue to play for a few more seasons.
Without tossing the you know what at the fan here, I'd venture to say it's even more annoying if you're Roy than someone else who had their record broken. For example, when Gretzky overtook the scoring record, you could tell he wouldn't just take it, he would shatter it. Brodeur, on the other hand, will likely retire in the next couple of seasons.
When you consider the defensive-minded teams Brodeur played in front of, and the fact that he got to play in an NHL that forced wins with the shootout, there is a debate to be had.
So the bottom line is, I think Roy was quite classy given the circumstance and can't be faulted for feeling a little jealous, which we all would.
''Yes we can!'' -Obama |
| freddyboy |
Posted - 03/15/2009 : 10:39:25
i hope he will have over 625, i think it's a good number and, it's possible, according to the fact he still have 2-3 years on his contract, and he approximatively wins 40/season.
joe is a god, if u dont agree....i dont care |
| Bozonator |
Posted - 03/15/2009 : 10:29:11
Did anyone notice his wink though? He did the classic Roy wink to the Camera.
But all around great record breaking night with a standing ovation for Brodeur and some booing for the Habs.
The question is how many wins will he finish with in his career. |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 03/15/2009 : 09:07:04
I don't think anyone who has met someone once can say weather or not a guy is a First Class A$$hole. That's perception and lack of meeting expectation. I am sure that other have this opinion as well, but as my old grampa used to say, Opinions are like a$$holes. Everyone has one and they all stink.
And I sure hope that we are not trying to compare the classiness of Roy to Brodeur here. If one considered a man who cheated on his wife with his wife's sister as a class act, there is a little learning about classiness required. |
| Sharksfan |
Posted - 03/15/2009 : 08:33:38
Kudos to the crowd in Montreal for the standing ovation after he tied the recond.
I don't think we're reading too much into the classlessness showed by Roy,I've had the opportunity to meet him,and although I can't take away from what he's done on the ice....off the ice he's a 1st class a**hole!
Congrats to Martin! I can't wait for you to officially break the record!
Thornton will finally get to sip from Lord Stanleys cup in '09 |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 03/15/2009 : 08:05:36
I think we might be looking into Roy's actions a little too much. You have to think that as much as these guys are saying the classy thing, there has to be a little disappointment in having someone else take over a record they held. We have to remember that these guys are still human and most of the players in the record book have huge egos. Don't kid yourself about that.
In the end, the fact that Roy was there was classy. Above this, they met in the morning and talked, which again was classy. Personally, I would think a one on one talk with the guy who's record I am about to take over is a lot more impactful than him clapping for me on TV.
And I agree with the Chicago thing, that will be a tough game for the Blackhawks. It's fitting it will be a home game for Jersey. |
| n/a |
Posted - 03/15/2009 : 05:01:32
I definitely didn't see a clap.
It was beautiful to see it happen in Montreal . . . just poetic justice, I tell ya. Kudos to Brodeur, I'd hate to be the next team to face Jersey now . . . I see it's Chicago. That'll be a tough game, and awfully difficult to get a shutout on them, but we'll see . . .
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
| irvine |
Posted - 03/14/2009 : 18:44:54
Is it me, or did Roy look a bit ticked off up in that press box. Never even clapped. heh. :/
Irvine |
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