| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| phlyguy90 |
Posted - 12/17/2009 : 13:17:52
upon retirement does rod brind'amour belong in the hall of fame? |
| 23 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Guest5070 |
Posted - 12/21/2009 : 11:10:21
No. |
| umteman |
Posted - 12/19/2009 : 15:35:14
quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA
quote:
Originally posted by umteman
Aside form posting what you know (ie., pure numbers) there are also intangibles to consider. Brid'Amour's leadership as captain was a big factor in Carolina's Stanley Cup trophy in much the same way Dave Andreychuk's veteran leadership was key to Tampa's Stanley cup win. Stats are big indicators but not the sole measure of the value of a players career.
Did you hear about the retired proctologist? He spent 40 years saying "what's a place like this doing in a girl like you?"
Refresh my memory is Andreychuk in the hall? I dont remember, and your right he is another player who at one point was a good/great player and heart and soul of a cup winning team, even though it did not show on the stats sheet.
Andreychuk, like Alexzander Mogilny, failed to make it in this their first year of eligibility. I expect both to be there eventually.
Did you hear about the retired proctologist? He spent 40 years saying "what's a place like this doing in a girl like you?" |
| Tiller33 |
Posted - 12/19/2009 : 12:14:17
quote:
Originally posted by umteman
I previously posed this question in another forum and then as now the verdict of our members was divided. And I am not surprised as I consider Brind'Amour to be the barometer of HOF borderline. I don't have a chrystal ball (or a HOF vote) but I will go out on a limb and say that eventually he will be inducted.
Did you hear about the retired proctologist? He spent 40 years saying "what's a place like this doing in a girl like you?"
I agree not a first ballot guy by anymeans but he'll be like a glenn anderson type guy who gets in eventually.
There's a lot of dirty old occ's around thats the problem |
| JOSHUACANADA |
Posted - 12/19/2009 : 09:26:11
quote:
Originally posted by umteman
Aside form posting what you know (ie., pure numbers) there are also intangibles to consider. Brid'Amour's leadership as captain was a big factor in Carolina's Stanley Cup trophy in much the same way Dave Andreychuk's veteran leadership was key to Tampa's Stanley cup win. Stats are big indicators but not the sole measure of the value of a players career.
Did you hear about the retired proctologist? He spent 40 years saying "what's a place like this doing in a girl like you?"
Refresh my memory is Andreychuk in the hall? I dont remember, and your right he is another player who at one point was a good/great player and heart and soul of a cup winning team, even though it did not show on the stats sheet. |
| Guest6946 |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 20:02:44
if clark gilles is in the HHOF then Brind'Amour belongs and so do a lot of other people. |
| umteman |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 18:49:49
Aside form posting what you know (ie., pure numbers) there are also intangibles to consider. Brid'Amour's leadership as captain was a big factor in Carolina's Stanley Cup trophy in much the same way Dave Andreychuk's veteran leadership was key to Tampa's Stanley cup win. Stats are big indicators but not the sole measure of the value of a players career.
Did you hear about the retired proctologist? He spent 40 years saying "what's a place like this doing in a girl like you?" |
| Alex116 |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 18:49:28
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
To this latest point, let's not forget Mr. Geriatric himself Chris Chilios. He is a first ballot HOFer when ever he decides he is done. And the last 3 NHL seasons with a total of 34 points does nothing to change the 3 time Norris, Multiple Cup winning, nearly 1500 career games, nearly 1000 points, and a career +352.
Absolutely Beans, great example. He's in even if he keeps playing for another 10 years! |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 15:18:32
To this latest point, let's not forget Mr. Geriatric himself Chris Chilios. He is a first ballot HOFer when ever he decides he is done. And the last 3 NHL seasons with a total of 34 points does nothing to change the 3 time Norris, Multiple Cup winning, nearly 1500 career games, nearly 1000 points, and a career +352.
|
| Alex116 |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 15:13:52
Josh, i too agree with what Beans has said that while he's been a very good player over the years, he's just not quite "there" as for as HOF material goes.
I do have a problem with your comment about retiring on a career high. Not to take that literally, as i know that's not what you meant, but i have no problem whatsoever with ANY player sticking around and playing till they're happy to retire. If Brind'Amour still loves the game and can contribute, i have no problem with him playing on if that's what he enjoys. I also don't think it should affect his legacy/career or HOF chances. Hypothetically, let's say this: If Gretzky were still playing today, was playing 9 mins a game contributing as a 4th liner and enjoying himself, i'd have no prob with it. If his career numbers took a brutal hit, so be it, he'd still get my HOF vote for the years he put up in his prime.
Another example, and this guy's def never gonna see the HOF other than as a guest would be Mike Keane. A three time cup champ (with three different teams), he's still playing, in the minors of all places. Yup, riding the bus and wearing the C with the Canucks farm team in Mannitoba, the Moose! From what i understand, he makes $75k / year? Well, i assume he's financially set anyway so he's prob just playing cuz he still enjoys it. I'd take $75k to play a game i love??? |
| JOSHUACANADA |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 13:10:21
I agree with the last points made. Faceoffs and stats does not make a hall of famer. Add to the list of accomplishments of captaining a stanley cup team and throughout his career considered a leader in the dressing rooms or on the ice of the World Cup and Olympic teams he played on. Work ethic like no other, how do you think he got the name Rod the Bod. His wiki say's his teamates would lock him in the Gym and shut the lights out cause he wouldn't leave. Unfortunately if he had retired after his cup win with a farewell tour he might already be in the hall as at the time he was considered a premier Canadian player and was well respected by players and coaches around the league. He is an excellent example of why you should retire on a career high. |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 12:47:42
quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA
quote:
Originally posted by Guest5052
Will he get in? ... maybe
Should he... I say unequivocally no. The Hall should be exclusive for great players. While he was good, maybe very good, he was never great.
He has had some longevity, and had a great career, but he was never really an upper eschelon player for a prolonged period of time.
Thats my two cents... I think that about of a lot of players.
For a prolonged period of time he was one of if not the greatest faceoff guy in the league and has stats better than some who are in the hall. Is that good enough for you?
Um, well to put it bluntly, no that's not good enough. Tell me one other face off specialist that is in the Hall of Fame?? I agree with the guest post, the HOF has become more of the Hall of Good or Very Good. Under today's criteria, I still think Brind'Amour is a stretch. However, I would not consider Rod the Bod in one of my all time best 100 lists.
When he was in his prime he was nothing more than a very good player. He was rarely if every in the elite class. His highest goal output was 36, highest assists 62, and highest point total 97. Only 4 times in 19 seasons did he average a PPG or more. His Playoff numbers are not staggering either. His best +/- seasons of 20 and 23 are bookended with bad seasons of -19 and -23.
It takes more than winning faces off to make it into the Hall. The more I think about this, the more I have to say I don't think he belongs. Sure, the Selke's don't hurt, but looking at the list of other Selke winners, it really doesn't make the case. I mean no one is talking about Mike Peca or Jere Lehtinen to be in the HOF and those guys each won the Selke 2 and 3 times respective.
Nope, I flipped on this. Brind'Amour is not HOF material. Very good player, yes. But not the in the best of all time. Consider this, a guy by the name of Tim Kerr played for the Flyers in the 80's and early 90's. He had 4 consecutive seasons of more than 50 goals (54, 54, 58, and 58), and injury season of only 8 games and they another season of 48 goals. He was a PPG player for 7 consecutive season. The guy had 5 shoulder surgeries in 14 months and finally had to hang them up. He finished his career with 674 points in 655 games. I would rather see a guy like Tim Kerr in the Hall before Brind'Amour. |
| JOSHUACANADA |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 12:15:44
quote:
Originally posted by Guest5052
Will he get in? ... maybe
Should he... I say unequivocally no. The Hall should be exclusive for great players. While he was good, maybe very good, he was never great.
He has had some longevity, and had a great career, but he was never really an upper eschelon player for a prolonged period of time.
Thats my two cents... I think that about of a lot of players.
For a prolonged period of time he was one of if not the greatest faceoff guy in the league and has stats better than some who are in the hall. Is that good enough for you? |
| Guest5052 |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 12:13:17
Will he get in? ... maybe
Should he... I say unequivocally no. The Hall should be exclusive for great players. While he was good, maybe very good, he was never great.
He has had some longevity, and had a great career, but he was never really an upper eschelon player for a prolonged period of time.
Thats my two cents... I think that about of a lot of players. |
| JOSHUACANADA |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 12:08:27
quote:
Originally posted by Gusteroni
I think he will be in one day, he has the numbers and longevity to be in. But I also think he's going to have to wait at least as long as Glenn Anderson did, which was way too long IMO.
"There are only two seasons in Canada...hockey season and not hockey season."
Someone has to tell him to retire now the longer he plays with sub-Brind'amour caliber play the least likely he is to get consideration. I mean even the great Brett Hull know when to call it a career, and thats a lot of ego to check. Rod may still be a good face off guy and a ok two-way player but its his stats that give him HOF consideration. BTW one of my favorite 90's players. |
| Gusteroni |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 11:19:57
I think he will be in one day, he has the numbers and longevity to be in. But I also think he's going to have to wait at least as long as Glenn Anderson did, which was way too long IMO.
"There are only two seasons in Canada...hockey season and not hockey season." |
| phlyguy90 |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 10:46:23
yeah i agree with you on that one my man. 1000 points, captain of a stanley cup team and two selkes should be good enough to get him in eventually. |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 08:59:03
Ok Folks, let's remember to post what you know not what you think. Brind'Amour has the past 4 season(not including the current season) of 70, 82, 51, and 51 points. Pretty effen good for the years of 34-38 especially when you consider one of those season was a Cup winning year and in 2 of the past 4 years he was rated the leagues best defensive Forward.
If that is not that good, it would be great to see what is good.
As far as HOF???? Not sure. Over 1000 point, a couple of Selke's, a Cup, 450ish goals. It's close. I don't believe that he is a first ballot kind of guy, but maybe he will be there. Maybe?? That's about a strong a word I can use. |
| umteman |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 03:38:13
oops! What's the NHLK?! lol
Did you hear about the retired proctologist? He spent 40 years saying "what's a place like this doing in a girl like you?" |
| umteman |
Posted - 12/18/2009 : 03:36:44
quote:
Originally posted by Guest5438
quote:
Originally posted by brentrock2
Well I think he don't really deserve to be in the hall of fame because the last couple years he was not that good. All the other players in the HHOF right now deserved it but I don't really think that Rod Brind'amour will belong in the HHOF.
Just to confirm, are you knocking his career based his last couple of years? If Mario or Gretz in their last couple of years sucked, would you keep them out of the Hall? Lidstrom has done nothing this year, would that mean he is not a HHOF? Please use some logic or confirm that you are one of those instant gratification people. Penner is in the Hall man, look at his numbers - uh I mean for the last 3 months.
I'm not sure for Rod. He is borderline close. He does have a cup. He is a darn good player. But to me, has he done anything in his career that is memorable? Other than the Selke, not really. To me he is out.
For a lage part of the 90's Brind'Amour was probably the most underrated player in the league. And don't forget that for several years of that decade he was the Flyers first line center, and for a long time one of the NHLK's best faceoff men.
Did you hear about the retired proctologist? He spent 40 years saying "what's a place like this doing in a girl like you?" |
| Guest5438 |
Posted - 12/17/2009 : 19:20:19
quote:
Originally posted by brentrock2
Well I think he don't really deserve to be in the hall of fame because the last couple years he was not that good. All the other players in the HHOF right now deserved it but I don't really think that Rod Brind'amour will belong in the HHOF.
Just to confirm, are you knocking his career based his last couple of years? If Mario or Gretz in their last couple of years sucked, would you keep them out of the Hall? Lidstrom has done nothing this year, would that mean he is not a HHOF? Please use some logic or confirm that you are one of those instant gratification people. Penner is in the Hall man, look at his numbers - uh I mean for the last 3 months.
I'm not sure for Rod. He is borderline close. He does have a cup. He is a darn good player. But to me, has he done anything in his career that is memorable? Other than the Selke, not really. To me he is out. |
| umteman |
Posted - 12/17/2009 : 17:54:49
I previously posed this question in another forum and then as now the verdict of our members was divided. And I am not surprised as I consider Brind'Amour to be the barometer of HOF borderline. I don't have a chrystal ball (or a HOF vote) but I will go out on a limb and say that eventually he will be inducted.
Did you hear about the retired proctologist? He spent 40 years saying "what's a place like this doing in a girl like you?" |
| 50brent |
Posted - 12/17/2009 : 17:19:08
i completely disagree brind'amour should be in the hall of fame because he was probably one of the best faceoff man in the game, and he has been a big part of carolinas success(not including this year) he may not have the most points or goals but in my mind he deserves to be in the hall of fame. |
| brentrock2 |
Posted - 12/17/2009 : 14:26:27
Well I think he don't really deserve to be in the hall of fame because the last couple years he was not that good. All the other players in the HHOF right now deserved it but I don't really think that Rod Brind'amour will belong in the HHOF.
HABS RULE!!
brentrock2 |
