| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Guest4647 |
Posted - 02/13/2013 : 19:31:02
Cooke injured another player this time was intentional what are your thoughts... |
| 37 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Alex116 |
Posted - 02/22/2013 : 10:23:17
Apparently Cooke has reached out to Karlsson via text to apologize for what happened. Karlsson has not replied and has stated he has no intention to speak to Cooke as he feels "they have nothing to say to each other"? He goes on to say that he doesn't think it was intentional but that it could have been avoided by "less aggresive playing" on Cooke's part? WTF? Sure, Cooke could play much less aggressive. He could also find himself out of hockey if he did? It's easy to say that if it were Henrik Sedin that this accident wouldn't have happened, but Cooke isn't Henrik Sedin! Karlsson needs to understand that some guys are more agressive than others and need to play this way to stay in the league!
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/nhl/story/2013/02/22/sp-nhl-ottawa-senators-erik-karlsson-matt-cooke.html |
| Guest4812 |
Posted - 02/20/2013 : 17:45:24
Put him in a Canucks uniform and I'm sure beans changes his tune |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 02/20/2013 : 05:28:02
quote:
Originally posted by Guest1779
Beans, we get you're still waiting...awesome
The crazy coincidence is that one of the dirtiest players in the game (despite his attempt to change this) injured one of the best players in the game. It wasn't Datsuyk or St. Louis that did it so you can take your hypotheticals out of this. Do I think he went into the boards with the intention of slicing Karlsson? No, I really don't. I do however this is was a very wreckless play the way he used his leg to help pin him and then stomps it back down. Like everyone else, I've watched this video numerous times and have trouble re-creating the situation where lifting the leg benefited him; it really didn't look like he was off balance. Players like Cooke are wired differently and only he knows how much of a complete accident it was. To me, it's something that could have been prevented
Even acknowledging at I am still waiting is more than most have done so I will honour this with a response.
Let me be blunt and brief:
Every single 'accident' or 'incident' is preventable with hindsight. All of them. Every single one. Including this one.
So what's your point? You're trying to say that Cooke is 'wired' differently. I say he changed his wiring after his last suspension. Facts prove my theory. Assumptions prove yours. |
| Guest1779 |
Posted - 02/20/2013 : 04:47:18
Beans, we get you're still waiting...awesome
The crazy coincidence is that one of the dirtiest players in the game (despite his attempt to change this) injured one of the best players in the game. It wasn't Datsuyk or St. Louis that did it so you can take your hypotheticals out of this. Do I think he went into the boards with the intention of slicing Karlsson? No, I really don't. I do however this is was a very wreckless play the way he used his leg to help pin him and then stomps it back down. Like everyone else, I've watched this video numerous times and have trouble re-creating the situation where lifting the leg benefited him; it really didn't look like he was off balance. Players like Cooke are wired differently and only he knows how much of a complete accident it was. To me, it's something that could have been prevented |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 02/19/2013 : 21:23:40
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Bad decision? Bad post.
To those talk this utter garbage about Cooke being involved with all these injuries:
Name one. Just one. Any single situation since his last suspension when Cooke was involve in a play that injured another player.
Until you can do that you are nothing but a hater who can't accept that Cooke is not same player he once was.
Waiting..........
Still waiting.......
Call it piling on if you want but if the shoe fits. How can such a reckless player go over 100 games without anything more than a minor penalty? More than 100 players had the same or more minor penalties than Cooke had last season (playing in all 82 games) and more than 300 players had more major penalties because Cooke had zero.
Reckless players can't do that. Plain and simple. His reputation is stuck with some people and it will never go away. |
| Alex116 |
Posted - 02/19/2013 : 09:31:19
quote:
Originally posted by Guest5091
quote:
Tell me something, is there even a history with these two? Did they clash earlier in the game? Did Karlsson nail a Penguin whereby Cooke was looking for payback??? Would there be a reason for anyone who thinks there was intent, that Cooke would have tried to do this, or is the thought that Karlsson's their best player, so i'll take him out??? I don't buy it.....
Slapshot a few moments beforehand where Cooke either got hit in the helmet or barely missed, I forget. I think it was from Gonchar, but he was steamed that whole shift.
I find it very strange that this hasn't been mentioned by anyone up until the point where i asked? Not a single report of anything close to this by any media, hockey analyst, etc?
Sorry, but if there was any proof to the fact that Cooke was "steamed that whole shift", i'm sure someone would have picked up on this and made a mention of it as "proof" that Cooke was malicious in his intents.
I'm not buyin' it..... |
| Guest5091 |
Posted - 02/19/2013 : 09:26:12
quote:
Tell me something, is there even a history with these two? Did they clash earlier in the game? Did Karlsson nail a Penguin whereby Cooke was looking for payback??? Would there be a reason for anyone who thinks there was intent, that Cooke would have tried to do this, or is the thought that Karlsson's their best player, so i'll take him out??? I don't buy it.....
Slapshot a few moments beforehand where Cooke either got hit in the helmet or barely missed, I forget. I think it was from Gonchar, but he was steamed that whole shift. |
| n/a |
Posted - 02/18/2013 : 17:09:17
quote:
Originally posted by willus3
I believe Cooke plays without any consideration for others player's health. Consequently he makes poor split second decisions that cause injuries.
If you think that Cooke didn't know that he was about to run his skate blade down the back of Karlsson's leg a split second before he did it and that in that split second he could not have chosen to avoid doing so, then so be it. I believe that a balanced human being would do everything he could to prevent injuring someone in that way. Even if it meant pulling your leg back and perhaps falling. You know where your skates are and in that situation there is no way he didn't know where Karlsson's legs were as he was pressed up against him.
I have to think that as Cooke was skating away he was thinking "why did I just do that?"
Bad decisions.
Fair enough then - I get this viewpoint totally. It's not unfair in the least. You think he plays with reckless endangerment, and that in this case, he did as usual, and the end result is . . . instead of potentially a near miss and a fall on the butt - or perhaps a minor laceration - it's a potentially career ending injury.
I'm somewhere a bit below that, myself . . . I honestly think he does play with reckless abaondonment at times, but that in this case, that may have been a fairly negligible factor. Not totally negligible, mind you - but almost.
Certainly not going to pile on you for that stance as others have. 
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
| JOSHUACANADA |
Posted - 02/18/2013 : 16:53:43
Funny part is like a contruction zone, his time on job between injuries goes back to 0 from that play. If another injury happens shortly after he will go back to being a suspect player, again.
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4904
This injury never would have happened if the league would have kicked him out a long time ago. Just the Marc Savard was career ending injury ... Wake up people ... He should not be in this league, and not because of the Karlsson injury. But with all other actions he committed in the past.
Rediculous!!! I guess people should never get suspended just completely kicked out of the league. Bertuzzi should have been gone, Scott Stevens injured countless players and ended various career, the list goes on and on.
Face it, this play was at worst a bit reckless but nothing malicious. If Cooke's name was removed the this was a player like Datsuyk or Martin St Louis then no one would be saying a word about it.
Face fact people, Cooke was at one time a very dirty player and he was suspended multiple times. Since his last suspension (over 100 games ago) he has significantly cleaned up his play.
Stop with the sour grapes. Injuries happen in hockey. Every single one of them could have been prevented in hindsight.
|
| Beans15 |
Posted - 02/18/2013 : 10:09:56
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4904
This injury never would have happened if the league would have kicked him out a long time ago. Just the Marc Savard was career ending injury ... Wake up people ... He should not be in this league, and not because of the Karlsson injury. But with all other actions he committed in the past.
Rediculous!!! I guess people should never get suspended just completely kicked out of the league. Bertuzzi should have been gone, Scott Stevens injured countless players and ended various career, the list goes on and on.
Face it, this play was at worst a bit reckless but nothing malicious. If Cooke's name was removed the this was a player like Datsuyk or Martin St Louis then no one would be saying a word about it.
Face fact people, Cooke was at one time a very dirty player and he was suspended multiple times. Since his last suspension (over 100 games ago) he has significantly cleaned up his play.
Stop with the sour grapes. Injuries happen in hockey. Every single one of them could have been prevented in hindsight. |
| Guest4904 |
Posted - 02/17/2013 : 18:20:47
This injury never would have happened if the league would have kicked him out a long time ago. Just the Marc Savard was career ending injury ... Wake up people ... He should not be in this league, and not because of the Karlsson injury. But with all other actions he committed in the past. |
| nuxfan |
Posted - 02/16/2013 : 11:57:16
quote:
Originally posted by Alex116
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
I agree somewhat with Willus that this play could have been avoided had Cooke not raised his leg during the initial contact with Karlsson. I'm not sure why he did, but as soon as it went up, he was off balance. Now you're riding a player in to the boards off-balance, with one foot in the air. The leg has to come down at some point, and it did, on Karlssons ankle. I think most players would have done the same thing in that unbalanced state.
I think that's very key here (Bolded). Also, the way i see it is his skate came off the ice due to being off balance and this was caused by the check itself. I think Cooke was trying to make sure he didn't get him from behind and therefore eased up slightly and if you look closely, their upper bodies (arms, sticks, etc) get tangled which is what looks to me the cause of the imbalance.
Still find it hard to believe that ANY player would enter a check like this with the though of using his skate as a weapon!
Tell me something, is there even a history with these two? Did they clash earlier in the game? Did Karlsson nail a Penguin whereby Cooke was looking for payback??? Would there be a reason for anyone who thinks there was intent, that Cooke would have tried to do this, or is the thought that Karlsson's their best player, so i'll take him out??? I don't buy it.....
Sorry, I should clarify - I meant that most players would lower their leg back to the ice once they hit their opponent into the boards. The board would have provided some stability, and its a good time to lower the leg and regain balance. I wasn't implying that any player would intentionally use his skate as a weapon, or that most players would come down on the ankle of an opponent.
The incident is eerily similar to the the Bieksa leg cut from a few years ago. During a battle along the boards with Fiddler, Fiddler's skate severely cut Bieksa's calf, and he ended up missing half a season. Fiddler has long been an agitator against VAN, yet no one thought that Fiddler did it intentionally.
As a result of Bieksa's woes, most VAN players now wear kevlar socks: http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=655652 |
| Alex116 |
Posted - 02/16/2013 : 11:01:48
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
I agree somewhat with Willus that this play could have been avoided had Cooke not raised his leg during the initial contact with Karlsson. I'm not sure why he did, but as soon as it went up, he was off balance. Now you're riding a player in to the boards off-balance, with one foot in the air. The leg has to come down at some point, and it did, on Karlssons ankle. I think most players would have done the same thing in that unbalanced state.
I think that's very key here (Bolded). Also, the way i see it is his skate came off the ice due to being off balance and this was caused by the check itself. I think Cooke was trying to make sure he didn't get him from behind and therefore eased up slightly and if you look closely, their upper bodies (arms, sticks, etc) get tangled which is what looks to me the cause of the imbalance.
Still find it hard to believe that ANY player would enter a check like this with the though of using his skate as a weapon!
Tell me something, is there even a history with these two? Did they clash earlier in the game? Did Karlsson nail a Penguin whereby Cooke was looking for payback??? Would there be a reason for anyone who thinks there was intent, that Cooke would have tried to do this, or is the thought that Karlsson's their best player, so i'll take him out??? I don't buy it..... |
| nuxfan |
Posted - 02/16/2013 : 10:42:11
quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA
I am not saying Cooke intentionally injured Karlsson, but his skate was up before he came into contact with the boards, not after as another poster suggested for balance. Either way this was not the intent, IMO, of the play just an unfortunate circumstance, which Ottawa fans have come familiar with too. Cooke may not be the dirty player he was before, but when his name hits the headlines for taking out another teams MVP player, you got to expect they will consider his history.
I think that is the point beans is trying to make. Most people are looking at this as "another Cooke incident", and rushing to judge him over the play.
I agree somewhat with Willus that this play could have been avoided had Cooke not raised his leg during the initial contact with Karlsson. I'm not sure why he did, but as soon as it went up, he was off balance. Now you're riding a player in to the boards off-balance, with one foot in the air. The leg has to come down at some point, and it did, on Karlssons ankle. I think most players would have done the same thing in that unbalanced state. |
| JOSHUACANADA |
Posted - 02/16/2013 : 08:10:49
I am not saying Cooke intentionally injured Karlsson, but his skate was up before he came into contact with the boards, not after as another poster suggested for balance. Either way this was not the intent, IMO, of the play just an unfortunate circumstance, which Ottawa fans have come familiar with too. Cooke may not be the dirty player he was before, but when his name hits the headlines for taking out another teams MVP player, you got to expect they will consider his history. |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 02/16/2013 : 07:43:16
Remove Cooke's name and put in any other player and this is a moot point. This is a hockey play have happens a dozen time a game. It's not often a skate hits the back of a players leg but one player rides another into the boards with one skate off the ice all the time.
Still waiting for the last player Cooke injured to not let his shake the reputation. |
| Pasty7 |
Posted - 02/16/2013 : 07:17:03
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4239
Where he's looking is inconsequential. He knows Karlsson is right next to him. "I'm going to hit him with my skate" doesn't need him to look precisely at where he's aiming. Those that think he has to look are viewing things with the assumption that he specifically wanted to hit him in the Achilles.
I personally think he wanted to slew-foot him and it went wrong. Is it dirty? Yes. Did he intend to put him out for season? I don't think so.
Still dirty.
Or he became off balance when he pinned Karlsson on the boards and one foot left the ground, then as any normal person does when on one foot loseing their balance he trys to get his other foot back on solid ground (or ice) and unfortunately under his foot is the back of Karlsson's leg, it's a hockey play Karlsson is not the first player to get cut by a skate blade, it sucks its unfortunate but it is obserd to place blame on anyone for this!
Hello, 911? It's an emergency, my teddy bear's been kidnapped!
[pause] Hello? Hello?
|
| Guest4239 |
Posted - 02/16/2013 : 07:11:18
Where he's looking is inconsequential. He knows Karlsson is right next to him. "I'm going to hit him with my skate" doesn't need him to look precisely at where he's aiming. Those that think he has to look are viewing things with the assumption that he specifically wanted to hit him in the Achilles.
I personally think he wanted to slew-foot him and it went wrong. Is it dirty? Yes. Did he intend to put him out for season? I don't think so.
Still dirty. |
| Pasty7 |
Posted - 02/16/2013 : 06:40:43
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Bad decision? Bad post.
To those talk this utter garbage about Cooke being involved with all these injuries:
Name one. Just one. Any single situation since his last suspension when Cooke was involve in a play that injured another player.
Until you can do that you are nothing but a hater who can't accept that Cooke is not same player he once was.
Waiting..........
Another point to this is look at the clip, Cooke is looking right, if he did it at all intentionally he would have to be looking at what he was doing, he is looking down into the corner the whole time never once does he even look at any part of Karlsson, he was looking at the puck,,
Hello, 911? It's an emergency, my teddy bear's been kidnapped!
[pause] Hello? Hello?
|
| Beans15 |
Posted - 02/15/2013 : 20:54:58
Bad decision? Bad post.
To those talk this utter garbage about Cooke being involved with all these injuries:
Name one. Just one. Any single situation since his last suspension when Cooke was involve in a play that injured another player.
Until you can do that you are nothing but a hater who can't accept that Cooke is not same player he once was.
Waiting.......... |
| willus3 |
Posted - 02/15/2013 : 17:06:41
quote:
Originally posted by slozo
quote:
Originally posted by willus3
Personally I think it's somewhat naive to assume there was no intent on Cooke's part. I'm not a big believer in coincidence. It seems to me a few good players have been injured with Cooke in the vicinity. Just a statistical anomaly I guess.
I could swallow you saying he was playing recklessly, Willus, and because of that, he increased the chances . . . of some kind of bad injury.
But actually - what are you saying, exactly?
He played recklessly and unsafely?
He played recklessly with some slight intent to potentially injure?
He went out with the idea to injure and maim?
Where along the ladder are you?
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
Do I think Cooke saw Karlsson and thought "i'm going to sever his achilles with my skate now"? No I do not. But...
I believe Cooke plays without any consideration for others player's health. Consequently he makes poor split second decisions that cause injuries.
If you think that Cooke didn't know that he was about to run his skate blade down the back of Karlsson's leg a split second before he did it and that in that split second he could not have chosen to avoid doing so, then so be it. I believe that a balanced human being would do everything he could to prevent injuring someone in that way. Even if it meant pulling your leg back and perhaps falling. You know where your skates are and in that situation there is no way he didn't know where Karlsson's legs were as he was pressed up against him.
I have to think that as Cooke was skating away he was thinking "why did I just do that?"
Bad decisions.
|
| JOSHUACANADA |
Posted - 02/15/2013 : 16:43:27
Actually, I read that the management in Ottawa would not seek punishment for Cooke. I think the anger is more about the bad luck they have had losing there top 2 players to injury and a top shutdown defenseman as well. The cupboards are bare except for mid level players, a vesina candidate goalie season so far and older former superstars. I dont understand why with all the cap space and the fact these players are on injured reserve why Ottawa doesnt seek players to step in from trade or free agent market. They even have the trade bait. It seems like they are trying to make it with spare parts. Hating the fact my team is in this position. |
| @valanche |
Posted - 02/15/2013 : 14:07:44
An unfortunate accident but the management in ottawa are angry which I find strange
66 is > than 99 |
| Mario 66 |
Posted - 02/15/2013 : 14:02:36
For those of you that call this deliberate have you taken the time look at the play at all or has your simple disdain for Matt Cooke clouded your judgement from the get go?
If he drove Karlsson into the boards with his eyes keyed in on the back of Karlssons leg from the moment of contact then I would be in agreement to suggest the deliberate act, but from the time of contact to the time Karlsson hits the ice Cooke's head is looking away from him the entire time. Now if your going to try and claim that at the speed of impact Cooke has the ability to blindly locate the achilles tendon and trigger in on it all the while making it appear as though it was a natural hockey motion then we need to change his name from Matt to Harry H.
Cookes actions in the past speak for themselves and all them were blatantly obvious attempts to injure, but this as stated by others is simply an instance where people hate Cooke for the player he was and will continue to make judgement based upon the actions of that player instead of the player that he has transitioned into the last two seasons.
Every journey begins with a single step. |
| JOSHUACANADA |
Posted - 02/15/2013 : 13:38:51
To be honest I immediately looked at the headline and made an assumption based on Cooke being the offender and Karlsson being the victim. But looking at the reply and what other posters have said i will give him the benefit of the doubt. Hate to see a player of Karlssons caliber sidelined with this type of an injury. Basically takes my team out of playoff contention without him and Spezza. |
| Guest4072 |
Posted - 02/15/2013 : 07:31:18
quote:
Originally posted by slozo
quote:
Originally posted by willus3
Personally I think it's somewhat naive to assume there was no intent on Cooke's part. I'm not a big believer in coincidence. It seems to me a few good players have been injured with Cooke in the vicinity. Just a statistical anomaly I guess.
I could swallow you saying he was playing recklessly, Willus, and because of that, he increased the chances . . . of some kind of bad injury.
But actually - what are you saying, exactly?
He played recklessly and unsafely?
He played recklessly with some slight intent to potentially injure?
He went out with the idea to injure and maim?
Where along the ladder are you?
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
The simple fact is Cooke is the most present player in major injuries. Many others played recklessly and never injuried another one players. It's a funny hazard at least!
Why always Cooke? That the question... |
| n/a |
Posted - 02/15/2013 : 05:40:08
quote:
Originally posted by willus3
Personally I think it's somewhat naive to assume there was no intent on Cooke's part. I'm not a big believer in coincidence. It seems to me a few good players have been injured with Cooke in the vicinity. Just a statistical anomaly I guess.
I could swallow you saying he was playing recklessly, Willus, and because of that, he increased the chances . . . of some kind of bad injury.
But actually - what are you saying, exactly?
He played recklessly and unsafely?
He played recklessly with some slight intent to potentially injure?
He went out with the idea to injure and maim?
Where along the ladder are you?
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 02/14/2013 : 20:59:23
quote:
Originally posted by willus3
Personally I think it's somewhat naive to assume there was no intent on Cooke's part. I'm not a big believer in coincidence. It seems to me a few good players have been injured with Cooke in the vicinity. Just a statistical anomaly I guess.
Name one since his last suspension when Shero called him out. Perfect example of that stigma never going away. |
| willus3 |
Posted - 02/14/2013 : 19:18:14
Personally I think it's somewhat naive to assume there was no intent on Cooke's part. I'm not a big believer in coincidence. It seems to me a few good players have been injured with Cooke in the vicinity. Just a statistical anomaly I guess.
|
| Beans15 |
Posted - 02/14/2013 : 18:09:37
This is a great example of a player not being able to shake their image. After Cooke's last suspension (where his own GM did not support him) there has been a huge effort on Cooke's part to clean up his game.
He did this significantly well. A player who had 3 consecutive 100+ PIM seasons and a notorious reputation for being a dirty player had just 22 minor penalties and 44 PIM (no majors, no misconducts) in 82 games last season.
Up to the Ottawa in Cooke has just 4 minor penalties and no misconducts or majors. He did get a misconduct against Ottawa.
A player with less than 50 PIM in 100 games who plays the style that Cooke does is not dirty but that image is stuck.
No intent on the play. |
| sahis34 |
Posted - 02/14/2013 : 12:26:05
I picked him unfortunately. Just an unlucky play though |
| Alex116 |
Posted - 02/14/2013 : 09:48:20
quote:
Originally posted by slozo
Tough, tough break fro Karlsson and the Sens . . . I have no love for the team from Ottawa, but you honestly hate to see a great young player like Karlsson go down, especially on something so fluky that could prove to be devastating to his career.
Clearly not intentional, and it's a shame we have to mention that - I suppose it's only because it happened to be Cooke who initiated the injury.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
Very well said Slozo, everything! Even though it prob helps many of us in hockey pools who didn't/don't own Karlsson, his loss is just bad in general for the game of hockey.
|
| n/a |
Posted - 02/14/2013 : 06:26:09
Tough, tough break fro Karlsson and the Sens . . . I have no love for the team from Ottawa, but you honestly hate to see a great young player like Karlsson go down, especially on something so fluky that could prove to be devastating to his career.
Clearly not intentional, and it's a shame we have to mention that - I suppose it's only because it happened to be Cooke who initiated the injury.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
| Guest2872 |
Posted - 02/14/2013 : 05:45:11
As a Flyers fan I hate Cooke! Even so, there is absolutely no way this was intentional!! Can't believe the Sens would even think that. I am sure they will have a change of heart when they see the replay.
Definitely a huge loss for them....along with Spezza! |
| Guest9053 |
Posted - 02/14/2013 : 05:10:19
So without Karlsson, Spezza and Cowen all long term, and others like Michalek on the short term, there's hardly a top-6 forward or top-4 D left on the team... Anderson can kiss his Vezina chances goodbye, at least.
Who do the sens draft first? Mackinnon or Jones? |
| Alex116 |
Posted - 02/13/2013 : 21:46:14
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4647
Cooke injured another player this time was intentional what are your thoughts...
That's absolutely ridiculous to say, and i'm no big fan of Cooke's! Yes Cooke has a reputation, but it takes more than that to deem that intentional! I just finished watching SportsCenter and Bob Mackenzie, Duthie, etc just went over this in detail and NONE OF THEM think it was intentional. They described the check as something you see multiple times every game.
Unfortunate, yes, intentional, no. |
| nuxfan |
Posted - 02/13/2013 : 21:08:05
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/opinion/2013/02/did-you-see-that-erik-karlssons-devastating-injury.html
An awkward hit for sure with the leg raise, and unfortunatly that leg has to come down somewhere. But from this replay, I don't think he intentionally comes down on Karlsson's leg - he's not even looking at the ice when his foot comes down.
Regardless, that is a brutal loss for OTT, and achilles heel injuries can be long. When Salo ruptured his a couple of years ago he was out for nearly 8 months... |
