| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Novie |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 05:37:51
A lot of people are calling the Northwest Division the "Toughest in the NHL", while the numbers show that the point totals needed to win the division are quite low. What do you think?
Go Sens |
| 17 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Blubberboy |
Posted - 12/31/2006 : 15:56:41
I agree with you Beans15.
Dumba**
Meatball.
Go Vancouver |
| Guest2048 |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 14:44:54
With Betman's schedule structure, you can't really compare teams
outside their own division very well (apples and oranges). Conference standings are a joke until they get this taken care of appropriately. The
NW division is a division of very equally balanced teams. Regardless if
they are great balanced teams, or mediocre balanced teams, it really doesnt matter as just because they are balanced, and they play each
other a zillion times, it is going to bring all the teams in the entire division
down in the conference standings. The schedule needs to be changed
so you at least play everyone in your conference equally, since that
is what is ranked for the playoffs. All the teams in the Northwest are
at a huge disadvantage under the current system and most would be challenging for top spot in any of the other divisions.
quote:
Originally posted by bablaboushka
Typical answer for someone from Alberta...
Dude, how can you argue their mediocrity, ALL 5 TEAMS ARE IN THE BOTTOM HALF OF THE LEAGUE STANDINGS. Mediocrity, technically is a compliment here. You must cheer for either the Flames or Oilers (maybe Vancouver) so of course it's easy for you to defend them. Face it buddy, it is a weak division. I know they've made Stanley Cup runs in the last two years, but so has the Southeast (Tampa in '04 and Carolina in '06, who both won the Cup). Does that make them a good division? It absolutely does not and in fact, the Southeast has been the weakest division for the past 6 years (at least, based on points). '04 was the first year in 10 years that a now Northwestern team has made it to the Cup Finals. The Pacific division only has one Cup ever, but does that make them a weak division? Absolutely not.
I said it was a dull race because the games are boring to watch. Props to Edmonton, they can usually keep a good pace going and Calgary can for about a period, but other than that any game these teams play is mind-numbing.
Again, people are trying to defend the Northwest (or Kiprusoff) based on stats other than wins, which are the ultimate goal. Sure Edmonton and Calgary made runs, but they both came up short. If you don't win the Cup, anything else is a failure. They failed just as much as San Jose did, despite having a better chance. When 5 teams in a division are a combined 9 games over .500, I would never consider it anything more than an OK division.
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| bablaboushka |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 12:55:15
I love the irony of people posting on a forum they don't care about to criticize the members of having too much free time...?
Anyways... |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 12:41:34
Guest 8351 is the reason that people should have to register to post.
What a meatball. |
| Guest8351 |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 11:58:07
Post deleted.
Moderator edit:
Come on buddy keep that kind of garbage out of here. If you want to post about hockey you're more than welcome to, but if not go watch some more OC. |
| bablaboushka |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 10:16:15
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
5) I meant no disrespect. Just trying to prove my arguement.
Neither did I, nor do I ever intend to be disrespectful. Unless you take a personal shot at me, which you clearly never did, I would never infer that you were trying to be either. What is strengthening your argument without using everything you've got! Anyways...
We've clearly reached a stalemate. I'm all argumented-out against you but I'm still interested in others' thoughts on it. |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 12/30/2006 : 09:59:28
I think I may have struck a nerve with Babs. Here's my rebuttle:
1) I never once shot down Anaheim or San Jose. I think they deserve everything that they have achieved to this point. It is hard to argue the fact that Phoenix and Los Angeles are a combined 10-21-4 against teams in the Pacific. So that tells me that a team in the Pacific is going to win 2 out of every 3 games againsts those two teams. If there is anything near a night off in the NHL, that would be it.
2) You are 100% correct. I would rather play in the North West that have to play Anahiem or San Jose 16 times a year. I never disagreed with the strength of the Pacific, just arguing that the North West is better than Mediocre.
3) How can you argue with the Home Records of the teams in the Northwest?? Combined, they are 62-29-3 while the much stronger Pacific is at 60-31-10. It's on the road where the teams have struggled, no question about it. However, that team from the Northwest that ends the year 3rd or better is going to be incredibly tough. Just as tough as the much stonger Pacific.
4) There is only one true measure of this division and that is how well they will fair in the playoffs this year. As it looks today, the Pacific should have three teams in the playoffs (SJ,ANA, DAL) and the Central will produce for sure 2 (NASH, DET). We know that the Northwest will bring in one for sure, hopefully Edmonton. That will leave two other spots. I am thinking they will both go to Northwest Teams. That's my gut any way. Chicago might sneak in, but that's yet to be determined. So, if my prediction comes in true, and there are 3 teams from the Northwest that make it, then they are just as strong as the Pacific. My ultimate arguement is that it is harder to succeed when all of the teams in your division are over .500 than in a division where there are teams that are not over .500.
5) I meant no disrespect. Just trying to prove my arguement. |
| bablaboushka |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 18:14:52
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
I think it is absurd to say that the North West is a medicore divison. There are no nights off in that division. You can talk all you want about standings and wins and everything else. Don't forget, not only is the division over .500, each team is also over .500 individually. Look at it this way. Dallas is 12-2-0 against other teams from the Pacific. Of those 14 games, 11 have been agaist LA and Phoenix and they have lost one of those games. That is 20 of thier 48 points againsts two week teams from thier division. So that is saying that Dallas is 1-1-0 against San Jose and Anaheim this year?? So Dallas is basically .500 against other teams that are .500.
Saying the NW is medicore is weak. If you said Mediocre on the road, I would agree whole heartedly. At home, those teams are great. All but Colorado have the same or better home record than any team in the league except for maybe Anahiem. Even taking the worst team in the NW(today) Minnesota has a home record of 14-3-1. That's good for the second best home record in the league. So, weak road teams, definately. Weak home teams, not at all! Mediocre?? I would like to see teams like Nashville, Dallas, Detroit, and San Jose play 32 games a year against the NW and see how well they fair. I promise you they would not be in the top 10 in the league.
What kind of hockey ever has nights off? I've never played that kind. It doesn't matter who you play against, it should never be a night off. And yeah I'll talk all I want about standings cause THAT'S WHAT MATTERS! If you include OT losses as losses for the +/- (cause essentially they're still losses), no team in the NW is above .500. So on that note, the Pacific is +20 and the NW is -2.
When you want to shoot down the Pacific, please get your stats right next time. Dallas has played 5 of its 14 games (not 3) against San Jose and Anaheim, having won 3 of them. And still, all that means is that they've coasted so far and will have it much tougher at the end of the season.
I would much rather play 32 games in the NW than be in the Coyotes' or Kings' shoes where they have to play 24 games against 3 of the top 8 teams in the league. It's not like the Coyotes are a walkover either, they've won their last 2 games, against San Jose and a shutout against Anaheim.
Let's look at the records of the four teams you mentioned against the NW (I tabbed them up myself so I might be a game off somewhere):
Dallas: 7-3-0
Nashville: 7-1-2
San Jose: 6-3-0
Detroit: 5-3-2
Oh gee sounds like the NW is much tougher than other divisions...? |
| Guest4868 |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 17:22:30
i dont think that the NW division has the best teams in the nhl. but i do belive it is the toughest to play in. there is no other division that has to play a harder 32 inter-division games. |
| Ryan Harper |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 16:37:11
Mediocre.
My Canucks are not a first place team, but hey, I am not going to complain about it. One of these teams is going to make third place, which is a huge advantage.
"Some people skate to the puck. I skate to where the puck is going to be."
~Wayne Gretzky
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| Beans15 |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 16:16:15
I think it is absurd to say that the North West is a medicore divison. There are no nights off in that division. You can talk all you want about standings and wins and everything else. Don't forget, not only is the division over .500, each team is also over .500 individually. Look at it this way. Dallas is 12-2-0 against other teams from the Pacific. Of those 14 games, 11 have been agaist LA and Phoenix and they have lost one of those games. That is 20 of thier 48 points againsts two week teams from thier division. So that is saying that Dallas is 1-1-0 against San Jose and Anaheim this year?? So Dallas is basically .500 against other teams that are .500.
Saying the NW is medicore is weak. If you said Mediocre on the road, I would agree whole heartedly. At home, those teams are great. All but Colorado have the same or better home record than any team in the league except for maybe Anahiem. Even taking the worst team in the NW(today) Minnesota has a home record of 14-3-1. That's good for the second best home record in the league. So, weak road teams, definately. Weak home teams, not at all! Mediocre?? I would like to see teams like Nashville, Dallas, Detroit, and San Jose play 32 games a year against the NW and see how well they fair. I promise you they would not be in the top 10 in the league. |
| Mikhailova |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 13:53:29
I said mediocre division. None of the teams are really that strong there. It might be a tight race among the teams IN the Northwest division, but compared to the rest of the NHL they're medicore. |
| leigh |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 12:18:45
I'm a Northwest division fan. It's pretty good hockey but I have to admit that none of the teams really stand out at this time. I agree it is a tough division, but if the playoffs were today I'm doubtful that any of these teams would make it past the second round (barring a goaltender awakening)
Having said that, I like that it is a tight race because it makes every game meaningful. It's almost half way and I think you'll see a couple teams make a move in the next 3 weeks. |
| bablaboushka |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 11:37:45
Typical answer for someone from Alberta...
Dude, how can you argue their mediocrity, ALL 5 TEAMS ARE IN THE BOTTOM HALF OF THE LEAGUE STANDINGS. Mediocrity, technically is a compliment here. You must cheer for either the Flames or Oilers (maybe Vancouver) so of course it's easy for you to defend them. Face it buddy, it is a weak division. I know they've made Stanley Cup runs in the last two years, but so has the Southeast (Tampa in '04 and Carolina in '06, who both won the Cup). Does that make them a good division? It absolutely does not and in fact, the Southeast has been the weakest division for the past 6 years (at least, based on points). '04 was the first year in 10 years that a now Northwestern team has made it to the Cup Finals. The Pacific division only has one Cup ever, but does that make them a weak division? Absolutely not.
I said it was a dull race because the games are boring to watch. Props to Edmonton, they can usually keep a good pace going and Calgary can for about a period, but other than that any game these teams play is mind-numbing.
Again, people are trying to defend the Northwest (or Kiprusoff) based on stats other than wins, which are the ultimate goal. Sure Edmonton and Calgary made runs, but they both came up short. If you don't win the Cup, anything else is a failure. They failed just as much as San Jose did, despite having a better chance. When 5 teams in a division are a combined 9 games over .500, I would never consider it anything more than an OK division. |
| Guest4868 |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 10:31:39
babs..i think its a little unfair to call it a "battle of mediocrity". the old argument that other divisions have the weak teams to beat up on 8 times a year still stands im my opinion. each northwest team is still above .500
as for "one dull race" i couldn't disagree more. this division very well could come down to the last couple of games...games that will seperate 3rd from 10th by maybe only 2 points. i dont find that dull at all, in fact...i would say that teams like buffalo and anahiem that will have thier division clinched with 20 games to go is dull.
and come on...the north west teams cant be so bad, in fact i seem to recall a northwest team making the stanley cup finals last two years in a row. |
| bablaboushka |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 07:01:14
It is just a mediocre division. Their NHL ranks are 16, 18, 19, 20 and 21. It's a battle of mediocrity. Only one of them is guaranteed a playoff spot and it isn't unrealistic that only the team who wins will make the playoffs. The other four, currently, are 7th, 8th, 9th and 10th in the Conference.
It's one dull race that will come down to the wire. |
| Novie |
Posted - 12/29/2006 : 05:40:43
At time of posting, Vancouver was leading the division with 39 pts, the other 4 teams were tied with 38. Those point totals in another division would get you:
4th in the Atlantic
Last in the Northeast
4th in the Southeast
3rd in the Central
4th in the Pacific
Granted, these teams play each other a lot, so balance plays a factor...but I say this division is pretty weak. Interested to see what others think.
Come on Flames fans, I know you're out there!
Go Sens |
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