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Hugh G. Rection
Rookie
165 Posts |
 Posted - 03/01/2010 : 14:23:44
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Ovechkin is routinely shown in a negative light in the Canadian sports media. When he had the multiple knee on knee incidents earlier this season tons of talking heads took turns saying how dirty he was and how he needed to be suspended. Beans, 99.9% you were one of these people. Then you have the Don Cherry's in the world criticizing his 'reckless' play and antics on and off the ice.
He doesn't get a free pass at all, but what do you want us to do? He pushed a cameraman whoop de freaking doo. I've seen it enough to know that more often than not its the camera man's fault. When I originally saw the piece they did on that video, it certainly didn't side with Ovechkin at all.
Want to know what a double-standard is?
Shoving 80000 cameras in front of someone and putting their every move under the spotlight then expecting them to act perfectly all of the time. People are human, and have flaws. This includes everyone in the NHL. People get angry sometimes. Notice the spats with paparazzi celebrities have every day and tell me how Ovechkin's outbursts aren't remarkably lame in comparison. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2010 : 16:18:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Hugh G. Rection
Ovechkin is routinely shown in a negative light in the Canadian sports media. When he had the multiple knee on knee incidents earlier this season tons of talking heads took turns saying how dirty he was and how he needed to be suspended. Beans, 99.9% you were one of these people. Then you have the Don Cherry's in the world criticizing his 'reckless' play and antics on and off the ice.
He doesn't get a free pass at all, but what do you want us to do? He pushed a cameraman whoop de freaking doo. I've seen it enough to know that more often than not its the camera man's fault. When I originally saw the piece they did on that video, it certainly didn't side with Ovechkin at all.
Want to know what a double-standard is?
Shoving 80000 cameras in front of someone and putting their every move under the spotlight then expecting them to act perfectly all of the time. People are human, and have flaws. This includes everyone in the NHL. People get angry sometimes. Notice the spats with paparazzi celebrities have every day and tell me how Ovechkin's outbursts aren't remarkably lame in comparison.
Really?? Before statements are made, homework should be done. Here is the link to the "Ovechkin Knee on Knee" thread. Please point out where I was one of the 99.9% of people that made these Ovechkin is a dirty player comments.
http://www.pickuphockey.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=9362
When calling someone out, at the least be accurate or one might run the risk of looking like a huge something, and it's not a reaction.
Secondly, people can continue to miss the point and it speaks volumes.
For a final time:
I could care less what you think about Ovechkin. That is not my argument. My question again is:
Why can Ovechkin do something such as this (rationale/justification is irrelevant) and people give him an automatic pass?
Let me give an example. People are saying aggressive camera man, pissed off he just lost, he's also asked for autographes, etc.
What if, hypothetically speaking, the camera "man" was actually a 10 yr old Russian kid living in Canada after his parents moved to Canada and Ovechkin is he hero. He was so excited to see him, he grabbed his Dad's camera and ran towards Ovechkin??
Then what?? Is he a d-bag then??
The point is that no one knows. It could be what everyone is saying and that it was an over agressive fan. But it could just as easily be a 10 yr old fan with his Dad's camcorder.
But because it's Ovechkins, automatic benefit of the doubt.
Here's Ovechkin's own words on the situation:
"I don't want to talk about it," he said. "It happened. I feel sorry, but it was an emotional moment for me. I don't want to say something bad or do something bad, but this happened. Let's forget about it and move forward."
The report is from the the Capital's insider for the Washington Post. Far from Canadian media.
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/capitalsinsider/ovechkin-canada-deserved-to-wi.html
Furthermore, the latest I found is that the "cameraman" actually was a girl. Apparently a fan that flew in from Russia to only watch Ovechkin play.
Now, to hopefully put some finality to this, I don't blame Ovechkin or the Fan. Personally I don't think fans should have this kind of access to a team, especially after a game. Although I don't condone his actions, I can completely understand how emotional and how serious this guys take the game of hockey. I don't believe there is a player that is a passionate about hockey as Ovechkin.
That being said, would it have been so hard for him to keep walking without reaching about and knocking hit girl to the ground?? I think that is what should have happened. |
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Guest9951
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Posted - 03/01/2010 : 18:39:07
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Why do people have a problem with him wearing russian clothing and a sheep on his skates? He is RUSSIAN! What is he supposed to wear? I happen to live in vancouver and saw a couple of russian atheletes walking together and guess what? they were wearing russia jackets! im mean what is ovechkin supposed to wear, go canada shirts? im sure canadains were wearing canada shirts at some point during the olympics. He is proud of his country and there is nothing wrong with that.
And as for the comment about wanting russia to win on canadian soil and there being nothing better? so what, he wants to win and there is nothing wrong with that. Hes not going to say, i want to beat canada but, there is better things to do. He has passion to win. im happy canada won, but whats wrong with ovechkin wanting to win? |
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Hugh G. Rection
Rookie
165 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2010 : 19:43:22
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It's interesting, Crosby plays as physical as the next guy, but he's a wimp. Ovechkin plays like a bumper car and he's a hero??I often think many hockey fans watched the game through Blue Tinted glasses, but I guess there are also some watching them through a mirror finished, gap tooth set of glasses too!
Knee on Knee is intent to injure. The NHL has established that a long time ago. 2 games is light. If it happens again, it will be 5+ for sure.
Furthermore, what the hell is Ovechkin thinking?? The most gifted goal scorer in the past 2 decades and he's throwing his body around like a meatball.
Keep it up, he will be washed up and broken down by the time he is 30. Playing in the KHL and we will all be talking about what could have been.
Sounds like a fair and unbiased report of your thoughts on Ovechkin. 99% you were in that camp, that post proved it. Tell me you didn't salivate at the mouth at the thought of Ovechkin being suspended for a good period. That would let your boy Crosby have a chance at winning the scoring title, at least. Why would you link a post you made that proves my point? Lol.
Also, the camera thing really isn't a big deal. Additionally, Ovechkin WAS suspended for his knee earlier this season, meaning he doesn't even get a free pass from his own league. Abandon your argument because it is bad. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2010 : 21:02:10
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So saying that Ovechkin is the most gifted goal scorer in the past 2 decades and that he plays like a "bumper car" says he plays dirty??
Well, I guess I did prove your point then.
Ovechkin got suspended because it was knee on knee. I agree with ANY player getting suspended for a knee on knee.
My arguement is bad because a knee on knee hit on the ice during an NHL game and a camera incident at a non-NHL sanctioned event were not treated the same.
Seriously, keep it up. I love the comedic breaks I get from the giberish.  |
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Thrasher
Rookie
Canada
155 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2010 : 22:02:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest9951
Why do people have a problem with him wearing russian clothing and a sheep on his skates? He is RUSSIAN! What is he supposed to wear? I happen to live in vancouver and saw a couple of russian atheletes walking together and guess what? they were wearing russia jackets! im mean what is ovechkin supposed to wear, go canada shirts? im sure canadains were wearing canada shirts at some point during the olympics. He is proud of his country and there is nothing wrong with that.
And as for the comment about wanting russia to win on canadian soil and there being nothing better? so what, he wants to win and there is nothing wrong with that. Hes not going to say, i want to beat canada but, there is better things to do. He has passion to win. im happy canada won, but whats wrong with ovechkin wanting to win?
I don't think anyone is complaining about Russian clothing. But he wore clothing saying Sochi. 2014 winter Olympics are being held in Sochi, Russia. Someone earlier brought up going to another kids birthday and bragging about how awesome your birthday will be. He could wear nothing but a Russian flag around him and most would have no problem (other than the nudity). I do however find it disrespectful that he would try and grab attention for his country's games when our country's were still going strong.. Take it however you wish, thats why forums like this exist, so people can state opinions. Nothing wrong with what anyone is saying.
The problem I find with Ovechkin is he is a media lover, just like Sean Avery. MOST (not all) Canadian and American players are fairly down to earth and don't get too carried away when being interviewed. Ovie is just so brash and unapologetic, almost like a NBA or NFL player. The reason i prefer Crosby to Ovie (other than i like Crosbys play style alot better), is he seems to be much more level headed and well spoken. Nothing is really that bad about what Ovie said about beating Canada, but there are better ways to say it. I guess the icing on top for me was watching the game against Russia and trying to figure out if Ovie got benched or injured in the game before. Total non factor.
I Promise I didn't give her the STD, I'm not a sharing person. |
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Hugh G. Rection
Rookie
165 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2010 : 22:11:18
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So you were in favour of him getting suspended? Cool. That's the only freaking thing I mentioned when I made the 99% comment. Read it again if you have to.
Your argument is bad because he receives a fair share of negative press as well as positive, both in Canada and outside. If you knew Russian, you'd probably see a ton of not-so nice headlines about him last week in his own country. The camera move was obviously out of line, but showed how pissed off he was at Russia's performance. It clearly meant alot to him. Not completely absolving him of all wrongdoing, but you can appreciate a guy explicitly denying access to the media being a little peeved at a camera in his face after a tough loss. I know I would be.
We have disqualified the 'I want to beat Canada' as a 'd-bag' thing to do. If you disagree you are wound up way too tight and probably hated Montgomery chugging the beer in the streets of Vancouver too.
Anything left? Ya he speaks his mind. Hockey needs more people that do this, not less. If he's pissed after a loss, I don't want to hear him say 'I really give credit to the other team, we didn't capitalize on our chances blah blah blah' like everyone else does.
Call him a d-bag all you want, the best thing about Ovechkin is he couldn't care less what you, or anyone else prints about him. |
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polishexpress
PickupHockey Pro
525 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2010 : 22:43:44
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Interestingly, Ovechkin was a chosen ambassador of the 2014 Sochi Games in Vancouver, or at least that's what one of the CTV commentators mentioned before they showed an interview of him in that clothing.
It seems were are all expecting perfection from those in the public spotlight, which has some merit. But should we really care that much about their choices and decisions and judge players on them, especially when we only ever know the story that the media decides to show us?
All I'm saying is that I we can really only judge players by what we see them do, and I just keep reading too many inferences and references that are unconfirmed. I really preferred when the arguments for/against Ovechkin were based on his actions when playing hockey, not his off-ice personality. Unless there are some of Ovies colleagues posting here, all we know about Ovechkin is how he is portrayed by the media. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2010 : 23:42:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Hugh G. Rection
So you were in favour of him getting suspended? Cool. That's the only freaking thing I mentioned when I made the 99% comment. Read it again if you have to.
Your argument is bad because he receives a fair share of negative press as well as positive, both in Canada and outside. If you knew Russian, you'd probably see a ton of not-so nice headlines about him last week in his own country. The camera move was obviously out of line, but showed how pissed off he was at Russia's performance. It clearly meant alot to him. Not completely absolving him of all wrongdoing, but you can appreciate a guy explicitly denying access to the media being a little peeved at a camera in his face after a tough loss. I know I would be.
We have disqualified the 'I want to beat Canada' as a 'd-bag' thing to do. If you disagree you are wound up way too tight and probably hated Montgomery chugging the beer in the streets of Vancouver too.
Anything left? Ya he speaks his mind. Hockey needs more people that do this, not less. If he's pissed after a loss, I don't want to hear him say 'I really give credit to the other team, we didn't capitalize on our chances blah blah blah' like everyone else does.
Call him a d-bag all you want, the best thing about Ovechkin is he couldn't care less what you, or anyone else prints about him.
Surprisinly Hugh, I disagree with little if anything of this. You are the first from the Pro-Ovechkin camp to actually say that his actions were questionable. I agree it shows he cares and is passionable about the game. I too love a guy who has more to say than the normal "We fought hard out there" line that most hockey players give.
Cool. Same Page. I get your point and if I agree or not is irrelevant. However, I do mostly agree.
I still think it would have been pretty cool to see a video of Ovechkin walking past a fan rather than through them. I wouldn't be able to say anything at that point. |
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deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2010 : 05:36:08
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So . . . any more thoughts from the "anti-Ovechkin" camp about most of the GOLD MEDAL WINNING CANADIANS not showing up to the closing ceremonies for their country?
Canadian media gave them a "free pass" . . . see: non-coverage and lots of "oh, it's ok, they just won the gold medal blah blah blah".
Well, I call it CLASSLESS.
Crosby - the face of Canada's gold medal winning hockey team and its overtime hero - SHOULD have been at the closing ceremonies, it's his goddamn responsibility! And don't tell me about no time . . . Michael J Fox was at the game and made it to the closing ceremonies, as did many many others.
Ovechkin, as torn up about Russia's loss as he was, also still decided to show his classy side by showing up for the closing ceremonies, even though it would have been very easy not to.
Oh, and Ovechkin went a step further by congratulating Canada and saying they deserved the gold here:
http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news;_ylt=ArbUTjj.astIhQbbWHysq8t7vLYF?slug=ap-blues-blackhawkstrade&prov=ap&type=lgns
Double standard much?
Where's the Crosby condemnation? Iginla condemnation? Scott Niedermeyer condemnation? etc etc
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Hugh G. Rection
Rookie
165 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2010 : 07:13:36
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Only counter-argument Slozo is that Ovechkin is one of the ambassadors to the Sochi games. That being said, Ryan Miller attended the closing ceremonies, so clearly Canadians probably should have if they were truly the embodiement of team Canada that everyone says they were.
THAT being said, they were probably absolutely hammered/wasted in the dressing room party that ended that game, it must have been an unreal stress reliever. This team met absurd expectations, so let them party it up like the women did.
So, although it probably would have been nice to see the Canadians at the closing ceremonies, I can understand why most (all?) of them weren't, and I wouldn't go so far as to say it was a classless move, just maybe a little bit unclassy (if that's a word).
Had the final game not been literally hours before the closing ceremonies, I'd have agreed with you though 100%. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2010 : 07:33:29
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Couple of things. Firstly, Miller was the only US team member visible at the closing ceremonies. Where were the rest of the Americans?? Kesler anyone??
Secondly, did anyone see the Swedes, Czechs, Fins, or Slovaks for that matter?? How many of them decided to get home a day early to get ready for their day job?? Are we attacking them??
Thirdly, does anyone think that Ovechkin would have been at the closing ceremonies if he was not one of the Sochi ambassadors?? Where were his Russian team mates?
Fourth, how does the entire Canadian team (and most other countries teams or at least notable players) not going to the Closing Ceremonies have anything to do with Ovechkin???
Now, to answer your question, I do agree that the Canadian Men's Hockey team should and could have been at the closing ceremonies. It would have been nice for Joe Fan to watch them parade in. It would have been great to see the most publicized team in the games on hand to end things. I agree with you. But there is no double standard when Ovechkin was part of the Closing Ceremonies. If Crosby (or any of his team mates) were planned into the Closing Ceremonies and they snubbed it to stay and party, then sure. Double standard. But when most of the other global teams did not have their players in attendance, there is no double standard at all.
Apples to Oranges.
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Guest5052
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Posted - 03/02/2010 : 08:03:54
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Well,
Ovechkin attending the closing ceremonies surely has to be considered a fairly classy act I would think. I think its too bad that the NHLers aren't fully immersed in the olympics (although I completely understand their massive other professional committments). Nice to see he made that effort.
As for pushing the Camera person - agreed he should not have. That shows a lack of class but Its easy to judge when most of us aren't used to losing in a pressure cooker and then having a camera shoved in our face, but thats part of the trade. Its a bad move, but really I must say I don't think its that bad (the knee on knees are much much worse in my opinion).
As for hypotheticals like what if the camera man were a 10 year old Russian Boy... what if he ate puppies? ....irrelevant, unless the cameraman was a 10 year old russian boy (or he ate puppies).
Don't be sexist with the sex of the camera person. She might be the next Victoria Corningstone.
I'm not the biggest Ovie fan - I cheer for Sid, but I do respect his play and his entertainment value. I thought that his extra little pat to Crosby after he lost was pure class... I like to see that even though he must have been devastated. I also liked this article,
http://www.winnipegsun.com/sports/vancouver2010/hockey/2010/03/02/13077706-ap.html and think it was classy.
as far as wearing Sochi gear, i think its in the olympic spirit especially with the treat from Bettman to pull NHL players from the games. I believe he has every right to make, and I do respect, that statement.
remember boys the voice of liberlism is the voice that is none too sure it is right. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2010 : 08:04:45
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I have to admit, i didn't watch the closing ceremonies, just saw some highlights. I was too busy stuck downtown in the massive party to be able to get home in time. Didn't PVR it seeing as did record the opennings and still haven't watched them fully  .
Personally, i don't think this has anything to do with Ovechkin aside from the fact he was there and our team wasn't. As it's been pointed out, he's an ambassador to Sochi, etc and you have to assume that's the reason he stuck around for an extra 3 or 4 days when likely the rest of the Russian squad had blown outta town?
I really would have liked and think we should have been treated to seeing the Canadian team at the closing ceremonies. Here's what i find tough, i guess because i'm not ever going to exsperience something like that, but with the games being in Canada, ask yourself this.....Wouldn't you love to walk into that stadium for the closing ceremonies after just having won the biggest game of your life? I'm sure GM Place (Hockey Canada Place?) was loud beyond belief when they won, but can you imagine the noise with 60,000 + at BC Place? I can't imagine missing that opportunity as a team and i'd have urged my team mates to attend if at all possible?
Back to Ovie....not sure of the link Slozo, but it came up with the minor trade between St. Louis and Chicago? I think the link you were after is here: http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news;_ylt=AmD4KTQdMy0DG5sZGI.yC3F7vLYF?slug=ap-ovechkinreturns&prov=ap&type=lgns
Anyway, i find it hard to believe that Ovie didn't watch the gold medal game aside from overtime yet was able to chime in that he felt Canada played better and looked fresher in OT? Huh? That seems a wee bit odd no?
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2010 : 09:24:13
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All I can do is laugh at the multitude of double standards, ignoring the point, and ignorance.
If people here cannot truly see that a double standard is being applied to Canadian superstars and Russian superstars, and then plead ignorance with lines like, "what does that have to do with it?" . . . then there is no way you will ever see.
I implore all of you to apply some critical thinking.
addendum: I can guarantee Ovechkin is at the closing ceremonies in Sochi if Russia wins gold.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Matt_Roberts85
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
936 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2010 : 10:11:44
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The 'cameraguy' in quiestion is a female reporter out of russia. You can hear her saying "dont break it! please dont break my camera" in russian. She got right in OV's way as he was leaving russia house after an embarassing performance against team canada and its hard to blame ov for being pissed but still he should have kept his cool.
This is getting overblown in my opinion..... i just find it funny.
I love Ov's entourage in the vid... that guy doesnt go anywhere without a couple supermodels at his side.
There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E". |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2010 : 11:04:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest5052
Don't be sexist with the sex of the camera person. She might be the next Victoria Corningstone.
I'm not sure who this was meant to be directed to but i certainly wasn't being sexist with my comments. I simply found it interesting that it seemed to go unnoticed that it was a female's voice we hear on the camera. |
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willus3
Moderator
Canada
1948 Posts |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2010 : 21:45:40
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quote:
Originally posted by willus3
Heard them say on CTV when talking about the American players and when they were leaving, that the flights were booked by team staff previously and they were leaving early Sunday evening. I suspect things were probably much the same for the Canadian team.
Here's an article about Ovechkin relevant to this discussion.
http://views.washingtonpost.com/world-wide-wilbon/wilbon/2010/03/crosby_miles_ahead_of_ovechkin.html
Willus, great article. If what this guy says is true and confirms the rumours that this "woman" was in fact a fan here in Vancouver ( i don't care where she flew in from really), then what he did is atrocious! I can completely understand how he prob felt at that point but there's no excuse for such behaviour! Pretty brutal in fact. I hope, as the writer said, that someone either with the Caps or at least someone close to him has a little chat with him!
As for the flights out on Sunday night, i'm not sure. I heard through a friend who was pissed they weren't at the closing ceremonies (he was there) that they (not sure how many, but some at the very least) went to Molson Hockey House instead of the closings??? Again, just heard this through a buddy so not sure it's entirely true? I did hear on the news today that Nash flew out to Columbus on the same flight as the Canucks (that would have been on Monday so he was def around Sunday night?). When you think about it, most teams didn't play till tonight (Tues) and i'm sure after what they'd been through that their coaches would have let them skip Monday practices! |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2010 : 22:22:43
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So much for what i heard on the radio? Just read that the Canucks were already in Columbus where they watched the gold medal game?
Then again, i guess the guy on the radio might have meant with the Canucks who were in the Olympics and there till the end? Luongo, Salo, Kesler, Demitra, etc??? |
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Odin
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
350 Posts |
Posted - 03/05/2010 : 08:27:09
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I gotta say I think some people on here are way too oversensitive or just have nothing to talk about so need to create some 'controversy.' There is nothing wrong with what he said or did. I am in total agreement with what Slozo said.
He is just expressing that he wants to be the best, and to be the best, you have to beat the best with the styling, profiling womanizing, limosine riding son of a gun! WOOOOOO!
And to do so on the bests own turf is just icing on the cake. Why anybody would begrudge this is beyond me. If we could do that to them, that would be terrific and I have absolutely no problem saying that. |
Edited by - Odin on 03/05/2010 08:28:52 |
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HawkinOilCountry
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
318 Posts |
Posted - 03/05/2010 : 08:59:27
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Ovie was pissed at a reporter? OMG what a tool. It's not like he'd just lost the biggest game of his tournament an was largely deemed ineffective during the loss. Oh wait...
It's not like he spent the entire tournament being hounded by all media, especially the russian media. No one would ever get pissed off at a reporter for that. Oh wait...
Ovie wore Sochi gear? OMG what a knob. The poster child of the Sochi games shouldn't be flaunting it! Oh wait...
Team Canada didn't come to the closing ceremonies? Those classless bastards. They probably didn't want to be seen as drunk in public like the other Canadian gold medal team. They were called classless too. And apparently the Team Captain being in attendance doesn't amount to a hill of beans to some people.
Or is the Men's team expected to NOT celebrate their win and stay calm and sober for the ceremony before hopping flights back to their teams? How dare they relax and enjoy themselves out of the spotlight before they go back to work!
I know you guys have a lot of feelings and what not, but this sounds like a whole lot of whine.
The arena wall in chicago should be credited with a goal. |
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Ovechkin's attitude 
