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HawkinOilCountry
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
318 Posts |
 Posted - 03/23/2010 : 08:46:18
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Poll Question:
It's draft day and your team has just completed one of the most dismal seasons in it's franchise history. What do you think the Oilers need to rebuild?
Try not to look at it as if I'm asking who's better between Hall, Seguin, Fowler. Think about the position and what the Oilers are missing from their roster.
For purposes of this poll when I say "Complete" I'm refering to a player that is going to play smart, responsible hockey on both ends of the rink.
And when I say Playmaker I'm refering to a good set up guy like Thornton or one of the Sedins.
The arena wall in chicago should be credited with a goal.
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HawkinOilCountry
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
318 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2010 : 08:53:18
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My vote goes to a Strong D-man; someone on the blue line that can do it all and do it well and responsibly.
A strong D-man to pair up with Whitney and hopefully develop into a top defensive pair could help the Oil re-build far faster than any forward currently availiable in the draft.
If I'm the Oilers GM I'll look for forward talent from some UFAs or Trades in the off season and get Eberle ready for the big show.
The arena wall in chicago should be credited with a goal. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2010 : 12:11:06
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My vote goes to the best possible player available. If that means a sniper, so be it. A playmaker, so be it. A defensemen, so be it.
It really doesn't matter. A #1 draft pick is used to build a team around. No one (in the top 3 prospects) will be a bad deal for the Oilers if they turn out to be what they are projected to be.
Personally, I really like the game that Taylor Hall brings to the table. It has been a good 15-20 years since the Oilers had a legitimate, bring the place to their feet kind of offensive threat. I think that he and Eberle will do some crazy stuff together, and when you throw in Omark, Svensson, Gagner, Cogliano, Smid, and Hemsky, that team's offensive ability is only about 2 seasons from showtime. As long as there are some stable defensemen in the system (Hellow Petry) then the Oil will be fine.
In the long run that is. |
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HawkinOilCountry
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
318 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2010 : 12:43:29
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You make a good point Beans.
I guess I was kind of looking at the team from a perspective of "which area are they worse off in". But when the team needs improvement in every area it really does come down to "the best you can get".
My two favorite teams are the Hawks and the Oilers. Chicago's defense is solid all around, and the Oilers D is giving away pucks like they were on sale, so I guess I kind of skewed my perception.
The arena wall in chicago should be credited with a goal. |
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polishexpress
PickupHockey Pro
525 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2010 : 13:33:03
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Oilers should get Seguin "complete" player, and a center. Name one Oiler who is a legitimate first line center? (Look at past stanley cup winners: Detroit has datsyuk, pits has malkin & crosby)
But pure goal scorer Hall is the financial choice, and who they will go for if they can, for reasons Beans stated above |
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Utemin
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
451 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2010 : 19:56:12
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| They have Linus Omark and a Complete D-man still that they can bring up. As far as I am concerned the best bet would be a Defensive D-Man like Mitchell and Seabrook, for obvious reasons, or a Power forward like Bertuzzi or Heatley to keep Linus Omark safe. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 06:29:26
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I voted other, thinking only one thing - same as the Leafs:
They need a superstar, or as Beans put it, the best player available.
I mean, if I am really, really answering the question, the answer is an all-star goalie - like it should be for any team. But as you all know, high draft goalies are very rare (Fleury is only one I can think of) and it looks like it's gonna be Taylor Hall as the projected #1. Hopefully for the Oil he turns into a real first line star, as I think Eberle will, and they can build from there.
I am really not sure though if this particular year's crop is all that, but that may just be a sour Leaf fan talking 
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Hugh G. Rection
Rookie
165 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 06:43:24
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High-draft goalie is gambling like crazy. For every Luongo and Fleury, there are also the Dipietro's, Price's (although juries still out there), Lehtonen's, etc. Not always pretty.
That all being said, scouting is miles ahead of what it used to be. Now it's getting harder and harder for teams to screw up their early picks due to near-consensus on the nucleus of top guys by the head scouts. Even the laziest scouting staff could just google Bob Mckensie and do an OK job of it.
And hockey isn't football, teams should never draft according to need if they have a lottery pick. You pick the best player available, period. Except in the rare occasion where the consensus best player is a goalie and you have Luongo/Miller already between your pipes. Let's also not assume that the Oil end up with the #1 pick. As last place, they only have a 25% chance of landing the honours. See below.
30th........... 25.0% (250 combinations)
29th........... 18.8% (188 combinations)
28th........... 14.2% (142 combinations)
27th........... 10.7% (107 combinations)
26th.............8.1% (81 combinations)
25th.............6.2% (62 combinations)
24th.............4.7% (47 combinations)
23rd.............3.6% (36 combinations)
22nd............ 2.7% (27 combinations)
21st.............2.1% (21 combinations)
20th.............1.5% (15 combinations)
19th.............1.1% (11 combinations)
18th.............0.8% (8 combinations)
17th.............0.5% (5 combinations)
75% chance by my math they don't get #1, so the decision between Hall or Seguin or anyone else may already be made for the Oiler's GM. |
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Guest2148
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Posted - 03/24/2010 : 07:07:37
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| The best theing that the Oilers could do is get another first round pick. Trading away a future pick with Cogliano and Souray should hopefully bring in some buyers especially a Pittsbugh or Washington. Since its a weaker draft this year the later round teams might trade for immediate help. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 07:21:33
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The odds are actually 50/50 of getting the 1st pick, as no team in the top 5 can drop more than 1 spot and no team can gain more han 4 spots. The dead last team in the league (the Oilers in this case) will either be 1st or 2nd overall.
Here is a good explaination from TSN(I left our the percentage list as Hugh has already posted it)
The following is the percentage listed of an NHL team being selected in the Draft Drawing - not the chance of landing the first overall pick. The team selected moves up a maximum of four spots. That means Edmonton has a 48.2 percent chance of picking first overall because teams seeded sitxh to 13th could win the draw but could not jump past the Oilers.
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 09:01:59
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Beans, read a rumour in the local paper here and wondering if you or perhaps anyone else has heard anything similar?
The piece is by Jim Jamieson of the Province newspaper and can be found here:
This is the part i'm referring to:
http://www.theprovince.com/sports/Provies+Nightly+Awards/2719671/story.html
BEST SPECULATION
Oilers fans (and media, of course) are slavering at the speculation that the Oilers might/could/should investigate a deal with Boston (which owns Toronto's first-round pick, from the Phil Kessel trade) to get that first rounder in exchange for high-skill winger Ales Hemsky and the Oilers' second-round pick (31st overall).
Oh yes, the Oil would also take Michael Ryder and his $4-million-US cap hit off the Bruins' hands. The result would allow the Oilers, certain to finish last overall, to draft one-two and get both Taylor Hall and Tyler Seguin and turbocharge their rebuilding program. This, of course, assumes Toronto doesn't overtake the Lightning, the Islanders or the Hurricanes -- upon which none of this works.
Think Boston would consider something like this? |
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Matt_Roberts85
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
936 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 09:34:55
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NO
not a chance
There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E". |
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HawkinOilCountry
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
318 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 09:38:07
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If I thought for a second that Hall or Seguin would be the next Sidney Crosby or Ovechkin then I'd consider that a worthy trade.
But I don't. Hemsky is the best skill player in edmonton. Why take two un-proven draft picks when we've got one locked up and have a skill player already to play top line while the draft pick develops?
Could I see Hemsky getting traded? Yes. Do I think it will help in the long run? No
The arena wall in chicago should be credited with a goal. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 10:39:07
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I would jump through hoops to make this happen.
Let's face it, Hemsky is a legitimate 1st line talent in the NHL but he is not a player to build a team around. Both Hall and Seguin have the potential to me. Or Hall and Fowler. Or Seguin and Fowler.
Hemsky has been in Edmonton since 02/03 and frankly, the Oilers have not been anything exciting in those times. Even in the season they made the cinderella run, Hemsky has never been 'the man" in Edmonton. Furthermore, in 2 years, Hemsky is a UFA and has already said that as much as he want to stay in Edmonton, he also want to win and that it might be too far away in Edmonton for that to happen.
Ultimately, I think this deal is too far in favor to the Oilers. Boston would be crazy to make this deal. However, if theydid, I will be jacked. Think about it. Eberle, Hall, Seguin, Svensson, Cogliano, Gagner. In 2-3 years, that may be the best top 6 forward group in hockey. The best thing about it is that 4 of those 6 will be making rookie level money, freeing up the cash for the Oilers to pay top teir defensemen.
If Tambo can pull this off, amazing.
On a side not, how poetic would it be that the Oilers (read Kevin Lowe) would get Burke's 1st round draft pick.
Awesome. |
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polishexpress
PickupHockey Pro
525 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 11:20:41
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Boston still has their own first round pick, right? And Toronto's next year!
So it could be very likely that Boston would be willing to trade away this year's pick for the right price.
Someone said Hemsky 2nd round pick for Michael Ryder and a 1st round pick? The Oilers would have to throw something more in, if the 1st pick ends up being a first, second, or third overall, wouldn't you think?
Tambellini would definitely looking into any deals that would improve the Oil . But, the Oilers are supposed to be dumping salary, and if I remember corretly, Hemsky makes more than Ryder, so it makes sense for the Oil. |
Edited by - polishexpress on 03/24/2010 11:21:58 |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 11:39:14
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quote:
Originally posted by polishexpress
Boston still has their own first round pick, right? And Toronto's next year!
So it could be very likely that Boston would be willing to trade away this year's pick for the right price.
Someone said Hemsky 2nd round pick for Michael Ryder and a 1st round pick? The Oilers would have to throw something more in, if the 1st pick ends up being a first, second, or third overall, wouldn't you think?
Tambellini would definitely looking into any deals that would improve the Oil . But, the Oilers are supposed to be dumping salary, and if I remember corretly, Hemsky makes more than Ryder, so it makes sense for the Oil.
Ya, but if you are rebuilding, it's irrelevant which player you are paying $4 million a year to. If it's Ryder but you get 2 of the first 3 picks out of the deal, so be it. In 2 years when the contract is done, you have an extra $4 million to spend on the kids.
I don't think the Oilers would have to give up much more than Hemsky and their 2nd round for Ryder and Boston's 1st round. But, with Boston and their issues with scoring this season, would the not rather keep their pick and have a shot at a kid like Hall who is appearing to be a dynamic scoring forward. Or, Hemsky, who is really a set up guy. Savard is already there and so is Bergeron. What more set up guys do you need?? Unless they pick up Hemsky and move Bergeron to someone to move back into the top 5 draft picks??
There a some many things that could happen for those draft picks, we can even begin to imagine. |
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impropriety
Top Prospect
Canada
78 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 12:51:20
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I completely agree with Hugh. Drafting to fill current gaps in the organization is a no-no. Top pick gets you the best player available, regardless of the position they play.
I touched on Boston's (Toronto's) draft pick in an earlier thread. Since then, Chiarelli's gone on record saying that pick isn't heading Edmonton's way for roster players - ie. Hemsky's off the table.
What I'm wondering is whether Edmonton wants to strike a deal with Columbus and gamble on whether Columbus picks 3rd overall. It'd give them another lottery ball and they could end up with Fowler as a consolation prize.
As far as drafting Fowler, though, he's not exactly in the same league as Hall and Seguin. It might be a good idea to pick him up, but (like I said before) don't draft him just because Edmonton's kind of thin on D-man prospects. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 13:38:10
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
On a side not, how poetic would it be that the Oilers (read Kevin Lowe) would get Burke's 1st round draft pick.
Awesome.
Yup, that'd be pretty awesome! Lemme guess, the sting of having the Leaf's logo instead of Mr. Bean(s) would prob subside a bit too huh? 
Beans, is this the first you've heard of this rumour? Just curious to see if it's been making the rounds in Oil town?
Also, if this is getting off topic too much and away from "Hawks" poll, feel free to move it to it's own thread if you deem necessary. |
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Guest0636
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Posted - 03/24/2010 : 13:59:50
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| where is the option to hang myself? suriously if i am the oilers gm i am considering that? wasnt franks and beans talking massive bs about kesler's new contract? what about penner lol what an overpaid piece o s***e. |
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Guest0940
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Posted - 03/24/2010 : 14:07:11
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"Think about it. Eberle, Hall, Seguin, Svensson, Cogliano, Gagner. In 2-3 years, that may be the best top 6 forward group in hockey"
HAHAHAHA
Fat chance of that beans. Cogliano, Gagner, Eberle, Svensson...will any of them ever weigh more than 180pds? They will be beaten up and beaten down. |
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impropriety
Top Prospect
Canada
78 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 14:13:19
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@ Guest0940:
Eberle clocks in at more than 180lbs right now, from what I gather. Odds are he'll put on another 15-20 in the next 5 years. I don't think that's a stretch.
Paajarvi-Svensson is 6ft tall and weighs just a hair less than 200.
I'm glad you didn't mention Omark, Beans. Like I mentioned in the last thread, I'm not 100% convinced he makes it past training camp 2010.
Edit: The Hockey News has Omark pegged at the 9th prospect in the Oilers organization behind Jordan Eberle, Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson, Jeff Petry, Taylor Chorney, Anton Lander, Teemu Hartikainen, Alex Plante, and Riley Nash. Do any of you think Omark is going to leapfrog ahead of the above-noted prospects in camp to play in the big show? |
Edited by - impropriety on 03/24/2010 14:36:14 |
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impropriety
Top Prospect
Canada
78 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 14:18:01
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@ Alex116:
I've been hearing mumblings about Boston's 1st for about a month now. I don't live in Edmonton but I'm relatively connected to the community. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 14:18:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest0636
where is the option to hang myself? suriously if i am the oilers gm i am considering that? wasnt franks and beans talking massive bs about kesler's new contract? what about penner lol what an overpaid piece o s***e.
Not one to usually defend Beans when Kesler's name is involved but really this has little or nothing to do with that. If you're comparing it with Ryder's contract, i think Beans said it best that the Oilers could afford to pay Ryder that money because they'd have so many young guys on entry level deals. By the time these guys come up for raises, Ryder's out the door and his contract is long gone! Makes a lot of sense to me.
Don't compare this to Beans' opinion of the Canucks signing Kesler to 5 mil per as his argument on that is that it could cripple the Canucks if he doesn't continue to perform. The Ryder trade wouldn't affect the Oilers in the same way.
BTW, Beans, you can thank me later for explaining this for you. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 14:56:48
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Most of the stories about this have just been tossed around the past few days on blogs and a bit in the Edmonton Papers.
Apparently, Penner and Gilbert were offered to Chiarelli went on record as to saying that he is not interest. However, an early exit from the playoffs and a lack of scoring depth might change his mind. Although, I would suggest is would take something more like Penner and Cogliano or Penner and Gagner. As good as Hemsky is, the more I think about the less I think Boston would be interested at all. Why go for a playmaker when you already have 2 great players in that spot and you have no goal scorer??
That being said, how much more attractive does Penner look this year as an viable sniper option when he was on pace for a 40+ goal season before Hemsky's injury and will still crack 30 basically on his own??? And, if we are talking about salaries, it's a wash if Ryder is coming the other way.
Now, as I stated above, if I was the guy in Boston I would not be giving away that draft pick for anything unless it was really in my favor. If Edmonton is willing to sell the farm, and maybe go with Penner, Cogliano, and their 31st overall pick for Ryder and the the 2nd overall pick, I might see it happening. Boston is not taking Gilberts bad contract and not taking much more contract at all. |
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baumer
Top Prospect
82 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 15:40:21
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| Ther is no way the Bruins give up this year's pick for anything. You are talking about what is almost guaranteed to be a top 2 pick. If anything they trade away next years pick at then end of that season. Depending on where the Leafs finish it might be top ten (hopefully closer to 20). It would take alot from the Oil for Chiarelli to give that up. Your best bet to get that pick and get rid of Hemsky, and it's a truly terrible scenario is if Marc Savard never plays again. Then Boston is ripe for the picking. But like I said that would be a miserable scenario. |
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2010 : 17:21:09
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I have to agree with baumer's opinion here that, Boston does not move Toronto's 1st Round Pick (2010), for virtually anything this year.
(Of course, no one passes up an amazing deal... but generally speaking, they keep the pick) and if anything, they trade Toronto's 2011 1st Round Pick.
Irvine/prez. |
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You're the Oiler's GM 
