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Guest4717
( )

Posted - 10/19/2011 :  10:44:31  Reply with Quote
Poll Question:
Will the Leafs finally make the playoffs?

Choices:

Hell, yeah, baby. They''re going all the way!
I''m already lining up my chair on Young Street!
No!
They''ll finish anywhere from 10th to 7th.

(Anonymous Vote)

admin
Forum Admin



Canada
2161 Posts

Posted - 10/19/2011 :  15:42:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
These answers are all over the map. When posting a poll. Please offer a few succinct answers. One of them above even implies "yes and no"! What kind of answer is that?
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TheRC
Rookie



105 Posts

Posted - 10/19/2011 :  20:29:39  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
They are off to a good start, but I won't let that translate to "plan the parade!" yet. I remain convinced that the Leafs are one of the teams bound to be in the running for one of the last playoff spots. I'm thinking (and hoping!) they will end up on the right side of 8th, but it's still too early to tell.

"If at first you don't succeed, you fail"
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BucketHead
Top Prospect



Canada
78 Posts

Posted - 10/19/2011 :  20:47:10  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
holy crap phil has 12 points in 5 games. how long can he keep it up.
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Guest6786
( )

Posted - 10/20/2011 :  05:47:13  Reply with Quote
so far so good, but they can't keep relying on the top line to do all the scoring. once they hit the road and lose the last change, your gonna see the oppositions best d-men against Kessel and Lupul everytime.
they really need that 2nd line to get going. its been showing spurts of good things, but for the most part (and last night especially) they've been horrible.
the PP still needs a lot of work, and they really have to stop turning the puck over at their own blueline. that kind of early game schlock is a killer!
Road trips are good to team bonding.......let's see how they do with this one.
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Guest3827
( )

Posted - 10/20/2011 :  15:42:31  Reply with Quote
I just want to point out one thing...
Montreal
Ottawa
Calgary
Colorado
Winnipeg

The leafs have beaten 1 borderline playoff team, 3 western teams on road trips, and Ottawa which many people have as #30 this year. Don't get too excited yet... If the leafs can get out of their first 10 games with 6-7 wins then we'll talk. Their next 5 games are against;

Boston
Montreal
Philly
NY Rangers
Pittsburgh
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Guest0006
( )

Posted - 10/21/2011 :  05:31:57  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest6786

so far so good, but they can't keep relying on the top line to do all the scoring. once they hit the road and lose the last change, your gonna see the oppositions best d-men against Kessel and Lupul everytime.
they really need that 2nd line to get going. its been showing spurts of good things, but for the most part (and last night especially) they've been horrible.
the PP still needs a lot of work, and they really have to stop turning the puck over at their own blueline. that kind of early game schlock is a killer!
Road trips are good to team bonding.......let's see how they do with this one.


after the beating the leafs took at the hands of bruins - you sir, hit the nail on the head!
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4575 Posts

Posted - 10/21/2011 :  05:46:38  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest3827

I just want to point out one thing...
Montreal
Ottawa
Calgary
Colorado
Winnipeg

The leafs have beaten 1 borderline playoff team, 3 western teams on road trips, and Ottawa which many people have as #30 this year. Don't get too excited yet... If the leafs can get out of their first 10 games with 6-7 wins then we'll talk. Their next 5 games are against;

Boston
Montreal
Philly
NY Rangers
Pittsburgh



The Leafs have beaten 1 playoff team from last year (Montreal) and the hottest surprise team from the West (Colorado) and a marginal playoff contender from the West (Calgary). Yes, Ottawa and Winnipeg should be weak teams this year, certainly. And it's a nice long home schedule to start, sure. And yes, the Leafs play some more difficult teams in the next 5, certainly.

I'd look for the Leafs to beat Montreal tomorrow, or at least get a point out of it. Philly at home looks way tough, but out of the Rangers and Pittsburgh, both are dealing with injury issues (although Pittsburgh has been great so far despite everything) and I think one out of two might be reasonable there.

I'd be ok with 3 or 4 points out of the next 4 games (after our loss in Boston) . . . it's a not unreasonable expectation for a team that I think is a playoff team, but not a top 5 or 6 team.

We'll see.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Guest5100
( )

Posted - 10/21/2011 :  06:26:55  Reply with Quote
The Leafs didn't beat Colorado.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4575 Posts

Posted - 10/21/2011 :  07:37:15  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest5100

The Leafs didn't beat Colorado.



That is quite true - my mistake. Got one point out of that contest, and were lucky to get that point in fact, correct.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Guest6786
( )

Posted - 10/21/2011 :  10:50:32  Reply with Quote
a good starting philosophy for any team that thinks they are a playoff team, is to win against the teams that are forecasted as non-playoff teams. so far that's what they have done.
Montreal is, for all intensive purposes, an equally matched team. but Ottawa, Calgary, Winnipeg, and Colorado (though their record right now states otherwise) are teams that most are not predicting as playoff teams this year. the Leafs took 9 out of 10 points from these teams. that's the start you want.
because at the end of the year, when you're sitting 2 or 3 pts out of the playoffs, and you look back and you see losses against such teams as Ottawa, Florida, etc., those are the games that make you say "why the frack didn't we win that one?!?!?!"
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8173 Posts

Posted - 10/21/2011 :  16:02:59  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
All I can add to this is that it is absurd to think about any team (Leafs or others) and playoffs at the 5 game mark. Heck, even the 20 game mark in a lot of cases is too soon to tell. The Leafs also started last season super hot. Who's to say they will not slide again this year?? Who's to say they won't continue their pace??

All I can say is that watching the Leafs in 3 full games and 2 other part games I have seend, this year has been on the backs of Phil Kessel and Dion Phanuef. Actually, that's not fair to the other guys who have been played in the first line. Bozak and Lupul have been great. The 2nd line has been weak with 5 points and -3 in 15 man games between Kulemin, Grabovski, and MacArthur. Also, 26th in GA in the NHL and having fewer goals for than against is a dangerous pattern. Reimer has been pedestrian this far.

Take nothing away from TO. They have been fun to watch so far. But there are things that indicate that long term troubles are ahead. Poor PP, poor PK, no secondary scoring, average goaltending. Not confident statements for the playoffs.

However, as I said, it is far far far too early to tell.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4575 Posts

Posted - 10/21/2011 :  16:54:21  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

All I can add to this is that it is absurd to think about any team (Leafs or others) and playoffs at the 5 game mark. Heck, even the 20 game mark in a lot of cases is too soon to tell. The Leafs also started last season super hot. Who's to say they will not slide again this year?? Who's to say they won't continue their pace??

All I can say is that watching the Leafs in 3 full games and 2 other part games I have seend, this year has been on the backs of Phil Kessel and Dion Phanuef. Actually, that's not fair to the other guys who have been played in the first line. Bozak and Lupul have been great. The 2nd line has been weak with 5 points and -3 in 15 man games between Kulemin, Grabovski, and MacArthur. Also, 26th in GA in the NHL and having fewer goals for than against is a dangerous pattern. Reimer has been pedestrian this far.

Take nothing away from TO. They have been fun to watch so far. But there are things that indicate that long term troubles are ahead. Poor PP, poor PK, no secondary scoring, average goaltending. Not confident statements for the playoffs.

However, as I said, it is far far far too early to tell.



The defence has been a bit on and off . . . Phaneuf has been great overall, and Kessel hot, yes - Lupul has been a revelation, yes. Wrong on Reimer IMHO - he has been very good. No Leaf fans have been disappointed with him at all so far, I think.

I have been disappointed with some defensive efforts though. I know Grabovski and Kulemin will pull it up, the effort and chances are there, it'll come. My worries are for our back-up goaltending, and our defensive alignments need tuning (to be expected with so many new d-men I suppose).

Other than that, the major pieces look good to me.

And frankly, it isn't just about doing well against the playoff teams . . . it's also beating the non-playoff teams as often as possible. Toronto's record against the Bruins last year looks ok, and against Buffalo was good . . . but they also lost too many games against bottom feeders, especially early in the season.

5 games does not a season make, no - you are right on that Beans (as if that would be any great revelation).

But it does give you a peek at how the team looks . . . and I still very much like what I see so far.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3581 Posts

Posted - 10/21/2011 :  17:03:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:

Wrong on Reimer IMHO - he has been very good.



Yeah, I have to agree with that - Reimer has been very good so far, esp for such a young goalie in such a pressure cooker. 4 wins, GAA around 2.5 and SV% of .915, good start.

That being said, as Beans says - we're only 5 games in.
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Guest9701
( )

Posted - 10/21/2011 :  21:03:03  Reply with Quote
The leafs will not make the playoffs this year. There are just too many good teams in the east. And my prediction is that kessel 's production will fade mid way thru the season if not earlier. Not this year leaf fans.
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TheRC
Rookie



105 Posts

Posted - 10/22/2011 :  08:45:24  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
IMO Reimer has been good enough to win close games, but not the kind of great that steals undeserved wins for his team. Considering the state of Leaf goaltending the past half a decade, I'll take it.

"If at first you don't succeed, you fail"
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8173 Posts

Posted - 10/22/2011 :  08:50:31  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan

quote:

Wrong on Reimer IMHO - he has been very good.



Yeah, I have to agree with that - Reimer has been very good so far, esp for such a young goalie in such a pressure cooker. 4 wins, GAA around 2.5 and SV% of .915, good start.

That being said, as Beans says - we're only 5 games in.




Sorry fellas, .913 sv% and 2.55 GAA puts Reimer on the 2nd page on for both stats. Neither is even top 20 in the NHL. They have won on the sticks of the first line, not on the pads of their keeper. He has not been great, he has been just good enough to win. At least that is my opinion of what the numbers tell me and the games I have watched.
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3581 Posts

Posted - 10/22/2011 :  10:11:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Sorry fellas, .913 sv% and 2.55 GAA puts Reimer on the 2nd page on for both stats. Neither is even top 20 in the NHL. They have won on the sticks of the first line, not on the pads of their keeper. He has not been great, he has been just good enough to win. At least that is my opinion of what the numbers tell me and the games I have watched.



His raw numbers are not incredible, granted - but a lot of top flight goalies are currently showing bad numbers, and the season is young yet. His team has not played particularly well in front of him at times either, no one is going to mistake TOR for a strong defensive team, and Reimer faces a fair number of shots. Yet despite that, he's only had one really bad game so far (that 6-5 win vs OTT where TOR allowed 5 3rd period goals). Besides that game, he's been reasonably solid in the net, and again other than that OTT game, I have not seen him give up a glaringly bad goal.

What I like about Reimer so far has been his ability to keep teams in games and give the offense a chance to win. In his last 3 games, TOR has staked the opposition to a lead early, only to see TOR win it in the 3rd period with goals. In that time, he has allowed no 3rd period goals (and only the one OT goal in the loss to COL). I think that shows great poise under pressure, and the team clearly feels confident with him in the net. All good things.

Anyway, 5 games is 5 games, so anything can happen. But if I'm a TOR fan, I would be pretty happy with his performance so far, given that he was a big question mark coming into this season. The Leafs are going to live or die by Reimer's performance (which is an incredible amount of pressure to put on a young goalie), and so far he's performed as hoped.
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Guest4038
( )

Posted - 10/22/2011 :  10:53:45  Reply with Quote
the shutout Reimer put up in game one against the Habs boost his confidence 100 times, and helped ease the pressure he must have been feeling. a game like that, in the situation he was in, goes a long long way. he'll be fine, and at season's end if the Leafs are once again on the outside looking in, he won't be the one people will be pointing fingers at.
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Guest9722
( )

Posted - 10/22/2011 :  13:23:17  Reply with Quote
A win is a win. As long as they can continue to win more than they are loosing, who cares it the team made the playoffs last year.

In order for the Leafs to make it to the playoffs, they need to beat teams that made the playoffs as well as the ones that did not. Will they make it??? Only time will tell.

It is funny that no other teams are criticized and micro evaluated as the Leafs are. And before anyone claims that it is because there are so many dilusional Leaf fans making "planning the parade" copmments, find another reason.

Most of the Leaf fans that I know are realistic and are hopeful for improvement. The number of Leaf bashers appear to far out number the dilusional leafs fans (one this site) from what I have seen and read.

The season has merely begun, sure they have started well, hopefully they continue. There is still a lot of hockey games left to be played. I am a fan of hockey first, then my team. I enjoy the game and enjoy watching and playing it.

It is Saturday night, got the beer chilling, the hot tub warming and friends on their way..... tell me how does it get much better than that......
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Porkchop73
PickupHockey Pro



640 Posts

Posted - 10/22/2011 :  14:26:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So Beans your basis for Reimers performance is on stats alone?
Why is it that you think it is his stats are the sole indicator of his performance and the fact it makes him pedestrian?

Let me give this analogy to help you see where I am coming from.
Lets say there is a very well know company that deals in high end technology that includes things like cellphones, tablets, computers and such. Their stats are indicating that they are not a leader in their field. Yet their stock or valuation of the company indicates they are a leader in their field. Indicating that their performance is indeed better then what the stats show.

You know i am leaf fan, and I do see Reimer as playing very solid. I would say he is playing at par if not a little better positionally then last year. He is still making the important saves when the game is on the line (against Calgary for example). Sometimes you can see a goalie is playing well just by watching. Stats are not everything but they do provide someone with a small amount of ammunition in a debate. You being an absolute Leaf hater or should I put it out there, anything Toronto hater, can only see Reimer as a pedestrian. You will not see him as anything else because of that.
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8173 Posts

Posted - 10/22/2011 :  14:50:25  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
No Chop, if you read what I posted you would see that I have watched 3 full and 2 other part games the Leafs have been involved in this season. I watched the entire games against Ottawa, Boston, and Montreal. I watched part of the Winnipeg game and part of the Calgary game. I didn't see any of the Colorado game.

So I am using what I have watched and the numbers support that. I didn't say that Reimer has been bad and I challenge anyone to show me where I did say he was bad. I said 'average' and I said "good enough to win but not great'. I also never said I was solely using stats to gauge his performance but did indicate his stats are on the bottom 1/2 of starters in the NHL so far.

The dumb "absolute Leaf hater' comments are the exact reason why I can not stand Leaf fans. I can't stand all the crying and whining from their fans who jump all over anyone who does not agree with their opinions of the Leafs and those who do not make strong comments about their play. So frankly, Mr Chop, keep your comments about me being a Leaf Hater to yourself because it has no bearing on my opinion. If the Leafs were 6-0 right now, outscoring teams, had a top 10 PK and PP and I was making statement such as 'average' and 'signs of trouble ahead' then you could very easily claim a bais and I couldn't argue. But that is not the case. The case is I have watched them play and not really dominate anyone. They got spanked by Boston, went to OT/SO against COL and WIN who are both predicted to be non-playoff teams, won a 1 goal game against a borderline team in Calgary, and won a solid game against Montreal by 2 goals. In that time they have been outscored overall, have a bottom 10 PK and PP, are 26th in the NHL in goals against, and have very little secondary scoring support. As I said, outside of the top line who is scoring in piles, there isn't much of the Leafs that can be called 'great' or 'solid'. Is that a biased, Leaf hating opinion??

Simply put, fans like you (and many other Leaf fans) very quickly confuse someone not being a Leaf Lover to automatically be a Leaf Hater. I can see fine. Reimer has been average and that's about it. The Leafs have won some games and looks average doing it.

How far off reality am I???
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Porkchop73
PickupHockey Pro



640 Posts

Posted - 10/22/2011 :  15:15:30  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
To be fair Beans, you did not say bad, but you made the comment that he has been quite pedestrian.
I can see from your post that you are actually talking about the Leafs as team and I would absolutely agree. However you were talking about Reimer in previous posts.

You mention the Leafs have won off the sticks of the first line. I would also say they won the Montreal game and the Calgary game off the play of Reimer as well. That is 50% of the games the leafs have won so far. I would go so far as to say that had it been Gustavsson in net for those games, the Leafs would have lost.

Beans, what is it about Reimers play that you find to be "pedestrian"? You have made statements to show the Leafs to be average, and you will get no argument from me about that, but you have not really shown reason that Reimer has been "pedestrian". If you meant good enough to win but not great then I would argue that is better then "pedestrian".
And I promise to not call you a Leaf Hater, I just know it gets your attention.
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8173 Posts

Posted - 10/22/2011 :  15:47:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Well this appears to be a argument of defintion more than anything. Pedestrian to me is average. Average to me is not win or lose but based on play. I don't believe that TO won the Calgary game on Reimer's play. In fact, I would say the exact opposite. If I recall, Reimer allowed 2 goals in the first period and both where clear viewed shots. No screen, no tipped shots. Just shots that got past him. TO came back and scored 3 in the 2nd and 3rd periods to win the game. So I would suggest they won in spite of Reimer, not because of him.

The Montreal game was a snoozer for the most part and either team could have won. I don't recall any saves or series of saves that tell me Reimer was the reason they won the game.

As I said, good enough to win but not great. I would suggest that of the 3 games they won by one goal, they lose those three games without Kessel, Lupul, Bozak, and Phaneuf's hot sticks.

Average, not great. He has not won a game for them yet, at least from what I watched. But how it happens is irrelevant, winning is winning.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4575 Posts

Posted - 10/24/2011 :  07:21:08  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Ho-hum.

Another pedestrian win by the Leafs on Saturday night against the Habs (who, it will be argued, are not a playoff team now).

Yawn. Ho-hum.

How pedestrian of them to be in first place in their division after 8 games.

yawn.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Guest7752
( )

Posted - 10/24/2011 :  12:09:22  Reply with Quote
As much as I hate to write this or even think about it - Leafs are a strong TEAM.
Regardless of whether or not Reimer wins them games, or Kessel is hot or cold, they get together and make the win happen. They are performing as a team.
Its no use deciphering games down to luck, bad ref calls, good goalie vs lucky goalie, playing against "weak" teams, home ice advantage, etc...
It seems that, at ANY GIVEN TIME during any game, wherever they are strong - they ARE strong, and wherever they lack some strength - they'll find an alternate to pitch in.
This is something Habs fans unfortunaltey cannot state at this point in time...
I am the first to crap all over the Leafs, but at this point - they deserve to be where they are as a team. I can only imagine where they would be if Wilson was out of the way.
Bring on the Capitals - Leafs will at least compete if they don't win... Can't say the same for Habs - at least for now.
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Guest6786
( )

Posted - 10/24/2011 :  13:03:15  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest7752


It seems that, at ANY GIVEN TIME during any game, wherever they are strong - they ARE strong, and wherever they lack some strength - they'll find an alternate to pitch in.



......except for that one game against Boston last week. If they can avoid games like that, and decrease the frequency from previous years in which they come up, then they should be ok.
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Open_Ice
Rookie



Canada
109 Posts

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  10:06:18  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So the leafs are playing better than last year right? Not so sure.

PP% - last year 16.0% this year 15.4%
PK% - last year 77.4% this year 75.0%
GA/G - last year 2.99 this year 3.38
S/G - last year 28.8 this year 26.4
SA/G - last year 31.0 this year 31.2

In all of these categories the leafs are statistically worse than last year. Yes this means absolutely nothing because the leafs are scoring more 5v5 goals this year and it's early in the season but these are some nasty numbers combined with the fact that the leafs have lost all three games against teams playing well. Now if the leafs start to lose games in streaks the numbers will quickly look bad. There could be trouble brewing...
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Guest6786
( )

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  10:28:06  Reply with Quote
I agree with Open Ice. they're early season record is good, but the stats show that they could be in trouble very quickly if they don't shape up. you cannot give up 4 goals a game and expect to keep winning.
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8173 Posts

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  10:46:12  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by slozo

Ho-hum.

Another pedestrian win by the Leafs on Saturday night against the Habs (who, it will be argued, are not a playoff team now).

Yawn. Ho-hum.

How pedestrian of them to be in first place in their division after 8 games.

yawn.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug


Ho-hum, another pedestrian 4 goals against for the Leafs.

Ho-hum, same game they have played in every other game this season only Kessel didn't have 2G and 1A.

Ho-hum, set your clock to the next annual Leaf collapse in November.

Ho-hum. Yawn. Nice to know that it takes 82 games to make the playoffs and not 8. Planning the parade yet.

Ho-hum
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4575 Posts

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  10:57:01  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

quote:
Originally posted by slozo

Ho-hum.

Another pedestrian win by the Leafs on Saturday night against the Habs (who, it will be argued, are not a playoff team now).

Yawn. Ho-hum.

How pedestrian of them to be in first place in their division after 8 games.

yawn.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug


Ho-hum, another pedestrian 4 goals against for the Leafs.

Ho-hum, same game they have played in every other game this season only Kessel didn't have 2G and 1A.

Ho-hum, set your clock to the next annual Leaf collapse in November.

Ho-hum. Yawn. Nice to know that it takes 82 games to make the playoffs and not 8. Planning the parade yet.

Ho-hum



I did of course expect this from you, knowing how menaingful and terrible it is for the Leafs to lose 4-2 to the Philly Flyers in their rink playing their back-up goalie.

Yep, I could have set my watch on it., lol.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Shepsky
Rookie



Canada
211 Posts

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  12:23:37  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The thing with James Reimer that really stands out above the stats, as mentioned is the timing of the saves, one thing that Reimer shows more potential than any other goalie to dawn the maple leaf in is breakaway/shootout goals. This has been a huge problem for Toronto, as they do tend to attack with their d a lot, which can lead to breakaways for the other team if not careful, see mondays game vs Philly.... The shootout has also been a huge problem for Toronto recently, but Reimer showed us that he can make saves when it goes to a shootout. This is what can give the leafs hope, maybe even through November, the time when all of us leaf fans are crossing fingers, as long as he returns quickly
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8173 Posts

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  12:58:38  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by slozo

quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

quote:
Originally posted by slozo

Ho-hum.

Another pedestrian win by the Leafs on Saturday night against the Habs (who, it will be argued, are not a playoff team now).

Yawn. Ho-hum.

How pedestrian of them to be in first place in their division after 8 games.

yawn.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug


Ho-hum, another pedestrian 4 goals against for the Leafs.

Ho-hum, same game they have played in every other game this season only Kessel didn't have 2G and 1A.

Ho-hum, set your clock to the next annual Leaf collapse in November.

Ho-hum. Yawn. Nice to know that it takes 82 games to make the playoffs and not 8. Planning the parade yet.

Ho-hum



I did of course expect this from you, knowing how menaingful and terrible it is for the Leafs to lose 4-2 to the Philly Flyers in their rink playing their back-up goalie.

Yep, I could have set my watch on it., lol.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug



Sounds like a excuse to me, but who am I to say. Ho-hum comments about a weak OT win over currently the 2nd worst team in the NHL where the Leafs gave up 4 goals are valid but a loss against a better team where the Leafs gave up 4 goal is not relevant because it wasn't a home win and Gustavsson was in net. The Leafs have allowed 4 or more goals in 4 of their 8 games.

But that doesn't matters. Ho-hum.
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TheRC
Rookie



105 Posts

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  13:31:01  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I wouldn't call 5-2-1 ho hum. And it seems flawed to predict a November collapse on the grounds that the team had a crappy November last year.

"If at first you don't succeed, you fail"
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5787 Posts

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  14:27:45  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by TheRC

I wouldn't call 5-2-1 ho hum. And it seems flawed to predict a November collapse on the grounds that the team had a crappy November last year.



I dunno, the Canucks stink EVERY Oct so maybe it's not that flawed? All kidding aside, i think it's safe to say that this quick start by the Leafs has bouyed the confidence in the team and it's fans, though if anyone thinks they'll continue to win at this pace, may just be getting a bit ahead of themselves?

Seeing the Habs struggle, and realizing they're one of the teams most expect the Leafs to battle for a playoff spot, must make a Leaf fan even happier!

Edited by - Alex116 on 10/25/2011 17:58:18
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OILINONTARIO
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
814 Posts

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  16:24:08  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan His team has not played particularly well in front of him at times either, no one is going to mistake TOR for a strong defensive team

Actually, the media in TO has made quite a big deal about the team's defensive acumen. Through the off-season, referencing the leadership of Phaneuf, the (possible) re-emergence of Komisarek, the signings of Liles and Franson, and the imminent blossoming of Schenn and Gardiner, the Leafs' D has been used as the prime source of playoff hope. Of course that has changed since. Now, it is once again Kessel who lead the Buds to the promised land. And don't blame the Monster, 'cause Reimer will be back soon enough. Difficult here to keep track of who the next saviour will be. Oh, yeah. Connoly.

The Oil WILL make the playoffs in 2012.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4575 Posts

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  17:34:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by OILINONTARIO

quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan His team has not played particularly well in front of him at times either, no one is going to mistake TOR for a strong defensive team

Actually, the media in TO has made quite a big deal about the team's defensive acumen. Through the off-season, referencing the leadership of Phaneuf, the (possible) re-emergence of Komisarek, the signings of Liles and Franson, and the imminent blossoming of Schenn and Gardiner, the Leafs' D has been used as the prime source of playoff hope. Of course that has changed since. Now, it is once again Kessel who lead the Buds to the promised land. And don't blame the Monster, 'cause Reimer will be back soon enough. Difficult here to keep track of who the next saviour will be. Oh, yeah. Connoly.

The Oil WILL make the playoffs in 2012.



Well, all that may be true and heard of, but don't confuse a Toronto hack sports writer with an informed opinion. The news outlets/rags KNOW that anything about the Leafs sells, so they print it like it's toilet paper, and it's usually worth about as much.

The defence supposedly being very good has been a point that I am following keenly right now. I have always contended that even when the D looks good on paper, when there are two or more new d-men (regulars, top 6) on the squad there is always a longer adjustment period than with forwards - in general. So, I am really waiting until the 15, 20 game mark to see what their last few half dozen games look like then, and I will sort of take that as a barometer then.

I am anxious about it, but overall, I think they will sort themselves out and become a very decent unit. Phaneuf has played much better than I thought he would, and Franson much worse, and Liles about what I thought. Schenn's been mostly bad, Gunnarson same as I thought, Komi same as I expected (quite ok).

We'll see!

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3581 Posts

Posted - 10/25/2011 :  18:40:38  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by OILINONTARIO
Actually, the media in TO has made quite a big deal about the team's defensive acumen. Through the off-season, referencing the leadership of Phaneuf, the (possible) re-emergence of Komisarek, the signings of Liles and Franson, and the imminent blossoming of Schenn and Gardiner, the Leafs' D has been used as the prime source of playoff hope. Of course that has changed since. Now, it is once again Kessel who lead the Buds to the promised land. And don't blame the Monster, 'cause Reimer will be back soon enough. Difficult here to keep track of who the next saviour will be. Oh, yeah. Connoly.

The Oil WILL make the playoffs in 2012.



Well, I'm not listening to the media - I'm looking at the stats. And the stats show me that TOR is tied for 3rd worst in the NHL in GA, only CBJ and OTT are worse right now. So they've been winning games on offense.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4575 Posts

Posted - 10/26/2011 :  08:17:06  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan

quote:
Originally posted by OILINONTARIO
Actually, the media in TO has made quite a big deal about the team's defensive acumen. Through the off-season, referencing the leadership of Phaneuf, the (possible) re-emergence of Komisarek, the signings of Liles and Franson, and the imminent blossoming of Schenn and Gardiner, the Leafs' D has been used as the prime source of playoff hope. Of course that has changed since. Now, it is once again Kessel who lead the Buds to the promised land. And don't blame the Monster, 'cause Reimer will be back soon enough. Difficult here to keep track of who the next saviour will be. Oh, yeah. Connoly.

The Oil WILL make the playoffs in 2012.



Well, I'm not listening to the media - I'm looking at the stats. And the stats show me that TOR is tied for 3rd worst in the NHL in GA, only CBJ and OTT are worse right now. So they've been winning games on offense.



Your point?
Oh wait - I think I made it for you, just look at what is in bold.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3581 Posts

Posted - 10/26/2011 :  09:19:09  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by slozo
Your point?
Oh wait - I think I made it for you, just look at what is in bold.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug



er, my point was that the Leafs have not been winning games with strong defense, as opposed to what OilinOntario posted. I thought it was pretty clear.

What made you think I was disputing the fact that the Leafs are winning games?
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8173 Posts

Posted - 10/26/2011 :  10:19:15  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hey, there is a forest but where are all the trees??

Gotta love the optimism with the 'winning games' comments. I appreciate that winning games is what the point is. I can't help but notice the long term concern at giving up 3-4 goals a game and give those goals up to weaker teams.

It would be like me saying how the Oilers are winning games is a good thing. Having the 2nd worst offense in the NHL is not a good thing. Expecting a 36 yr old goalie to continue allowing less than a goal a game and saving 97% of the shots he faces is not a good thing. I recognize the Oilers can expect to not maintain that defensive pace and need to score more goals to continue winning.

But, I guess as far the Leafs goes, giving up more than 3 goals a game is fine as long as they keep winning. Frankly, if anyone expects Kessel to maintain his 170 pt season pace, please call me. I have a bridge to sell you.


The start of the season (IMO) is less about winning or losing but how you are winning or losing. That is normally what tells one about the long term potential of the season. Not saying the Leafs are done, but playing better defensive and playing better on the special teams will be key for their success this season.
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