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Guest9184
( )

Posted - 03/28/2012 :  17:25:50  Reply with Quote
The Calgary Flames have been written off more times this season than charitable donations on income tax returns. Yet with 11 days left in the regular season, they can move into a three-way tie for seventh place with a victory against the Los Angeles Kings and losses by the Dallas Stars and Colorado Avalanche.

Even if everything falls perfectly Wednesday night, the 11th-place Flames will still only rise as high as ninth in the Western Conference standings due to tiebreakers, but their 87 points would be tied for the seventh-most in the West with four games remaining.

The ninth-place Kings, who have 86 points, could jump to seventh with a victory at Scotiabank Saddledome. The Flames have taken two of three in the season series, but the Kings' one victory came in Calgary.

Clatts
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
266 Posts

Posted - 03/28/2012 :  19:27:49  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Go Flames!

"Most of the guys that wear them are Europeans and French Guys."
Don Cherry on Visors
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semin-rules
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1915 Posts

Posted - 03/28/2012 :  22:46:22  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Flames got shutout and the Stars won!

Looks like it just is not Calgary's year
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Clatts
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
266 Posts

Posted - 03/29/2012 :  14:07:17  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Mathematically not out of the playoff yet, but dose not look good, IF and thats a big IF they win there last 4 games outright they have a 70% chance of making the playoffs.

With 2 of the last 4 against Vancouver i'm not holding out much hope.

"Most of the guys that wear them are Europeans and French Guys."
Don Cherry on Visors

Edited by - Clatts on 03/29/2012 14:07:55
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leigh
Moderator



Canada
1601 Posts

Posted - 03/29/2012 :  16:33:51  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I hear you Clatts. Our boys are pretty much done. Tiny chance at best. They only have one game in hand on Colorado and the others have a game or games in hand on Cgy. Essentially the Flames would need to run the table on the last 4 (two against Van as you said) and three of the teams in the race ahead of them would have to absolutely tank.

Time to dust off the clubs.
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Guest4465
( )

Posted - 03/31/2012 :  05:28:11  Reply with Quote
Calgary don't have a shot!!

They are a very poor team that refuses to let Jerome Iginla leave for greener pastures. a.k.a for him to win a CUP!!

Prediction for Stanley Cup Final:

VANCOUVER CANUCKS vs PITTSBURGH PENGUINS
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Shepsky
Rookie



Canada
211 Posts

Posted - 03/31/2012 :  06:58:22  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4465

Calgary don't have a shot!!

They are a very poor team that refuses to let Jerome Iginla leave for greener pastures. a.k.a for him to win a CUP!!

Prediction for Stanley Cup Final:

VANCOUVER CANUCKS vs PITTSBURGH PENGUINS



Vancouver will NOT make the final round this year, my prediction

Every day is a great day for hockey
-Mario Lemieux
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Guest4005
( )

Posted - 03/31/2012 :  08:36:44  Reply with Quote
Forget about the Flames in the playoff this year.

In he east, ok with Pittsburgh in final but Vancouver would not beat Nashville this year, or maybe the Blues...
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Clatts
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
266 Posts

Posted - 03/31/2012 :  17:15:12  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4465

Calgary don't have a shot!!

They are a very poor team that refuses to let Jerome Iginla leave for greener pastures. a.k.a for him to win a CUP!!

Prediction for Stanley Cup Final:

VANCOUVER CANUCKS vs PITTSBURGH PENGUINS



I wouldn't call them a poor team and Jerome had clearly stated that he wants to win a cup....in CALGARY. Pretty hard to refuse to let someone go that does not express interest in leaving and had a no-trade clause.

"Most of the guys that wear them are Europeans and French Guys."
Don Cherry on Visors
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4516 Posts

Posted - 04/01/2012 :  06:26:12  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4465

Calgary don't have a shot!!

They are a very poor team that refuses to let Jerome Iginla leave for greener pastures. a.k.a for him to win a CUP!!

Prediction for Stanley Cup Final:

VANCOUVER CANUCKS vs PITTSBURGH PENGUINS



As a Leafs fan, I am all too familiar with this kind of ignorant post - seriously, what is the point of putting down a team that misses the playoffs?

Very poor? Hardly. With Kipper and Iggy there - even a diminished Iggy - they were always competetive. And their defence is pretty solid overall, and there are some future bright pieces there.

To me, the real question is the fallout from this season's miss, and whether Iginla finally allows himself to be traded so that the team can do an Ottawa-style quick "rebuild". And, even more importantly, whether they want to go further than that and trade Kipper - while his stock is still relatively high - and do a full rebuild.

They made a good run at it, but the west is just so competetive for those bottom 4 playoff spots . . .

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8153 Posts

Posted - 04/01/2012 :  07:54:53  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think that opinion is not ignorant at all. Factually speaking, The Flames have not done a thing for a two decades. Sure, they had a run at the Cup that was unexpected. But, c'mon! The Flames have missed the playoffs in 9 of the last 14 years and were punted from the playoffs in the first round in 3 more season. Since their Cup win they have 10 seasons of missed playoffs and 10 seasons of losing the first playoff series.

It's not an ignorant statement to say this team is horrible. They are. Finishing 30th or 17th is still missing the playoffs, isn't it? Difference being is finishing 17th does not get talent prospects into the team. People have complained for years that Iginla hasn't played with a talented centre. Who's fault is that? Their draft positions have been crap and they have drafted horribly with the picks they have. Other than Phaneuf and Lombardi (both now Leafs) there is not a single Flames player with more than 100 career points since before 2000. Complete garbage trades along the way have not help matters.

I get that fans are sensitive about their favorite team but there is nothing ignorant about speaking the truth. There is no sugar coating needed in this case. The Flames are a bad hockey team. They one potential shining star and a pile of aging and underachieveing players.

It really is a shame that Iginla and Kiprusoff choose to stay on a sinking ship. They had their shot and missed. Those players will never get a sniff of the Cup again.
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OILINONTARIO
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
809 Posts

Posted - 04/01/2012 :  13:23:00  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I disagree. By keeping Iginla and Kipper, as well as the reclamation of Jokinen and Cammaleri, this team looks great for the future. Also, the infusion of Leafs' castoffs via the Phaneuf trade has given them unprecedented depth. As a matter of fact, I, as an expatriot Albertan,living in God's country, out here in Ontario, believe I might switch my loyalties from the Wild Rose capital to her fair sister to the south. Sven Baertchi is God.

Also, being a realist, I am whole-heartedly cheering for the Canucks this spring. Luongo will show that he is real. The Sedins will lead the path to glory, and the rejuvenated D-corps will win the day.

The Oil WILL make the playoffs in 2013.
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Clatts
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
266 Posts

Posted - 04/01/2012 :  19:10:19  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

I think that opinion is not ignorant at all. Factually speaking, The Flames have not done a thing for a two decades. Sure, they had a run at the Cup that was unexpected. But, c'mon! The Flames have missed the playoffs in 9 of the last 14 years and were punted from the playoffs in the first round in 3 more season. Since their Cup win they have 10 seasons of missed playoffs and 10 seasons of losing the first playoff series.

It's not an ignorant statement to say this team is horrible. They are. Finishing 30th or 17th is still missing the playoffs, isn't it? Difference being is finishing 17th does not get talent prospects into the team. People have complained for years that Iginla hasn't played with a talented centre. Who's fault is that? Their draft positions have been crap and they have drafted horribly with the picks they have. Other than Phaneuf and Lombardi (both now Leafs) there is not a single Flames player with more than 100 career points since before 2000. Complete garbage trades along the way have not help matters.

I get that fans are sensitive about their favorite team but there is nothing ignorant about speaking the truth. There is no sugar coating needed in this case. The Flames are a bad hockey team. They one potential shining star and a pile of aging and underachieveing players.

It really is a shame that Iginla and Kiprusoff choose to stay on a sinking ship. They had their shot and missed. Those players will never get a sniff of the Cup again.



This is the most ignorant post i've ever seen from you Beans, why do you have to go back so far, "9 of they last 14 years"? Could it be because Calgary has had a decent team for 8 years.

FACT!

2012 - 4 points out
2011 - 3 points out
2010 - 5 points out
2009 - 5th in the west
2008 - 7th in the west
2007 - 8th in the west
2006 - 3rd in the west
2004 - 6th in the west

FACT!

6 wins away from making the playoffs 8 season in a row.

I hate the mentality that you either have to win a cup or try to finish last so you get top prospects....hows that working for Edmonton? Eberle,Hall,RNH and other higher picks and what 2nd to last place in the league? No thanks I still like to watch meaningful hockey after christmas.

"Most of the guys that wear them are Europeans and French Guys."
Don Cherry on Visors
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8153 Posts

Posted - 04/01/2012 :  20:39:29  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Remember this post you made regarding the Oilers over the next five seasons, then we will talk. If we are going to talk about ignorant today, we will forgive the fact that one of the players you mentioned playing for those horrible Oilers(Eberle) outscored every Flame player. Let's also look at the fact that both Hopkins and Hall have a better PPG than the leading scorer for the Flames. And of course the fact that these kids are all under the age of 21.

Finally, and most importantly, the differece between the Oilers and the Flames this year is 3 reg wins and seven overtime overtime losses.

I guess the idea of meaningful hockey games after Christmas is praying your team can hang on long enough to get an overtime point?? Yep, keep scraping out for that final playoff spot or miss the playoffs every year and enoy those middle of the road picks, when the moron GM's don't trade them away.

Yep, ignorant is a great word. Another that comes to mind is delusional.
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Clatts
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
266 Posts

Posted - 04/02/2012 :  07:04:25  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

Remember this post you made regarding the Oilers over the next five seasons, then we will talk. If we are going to talk about ignorant today, we will forgive the fact that one of the players you mentioned playing for those horrible Oilers(Eberle) outscored every Flame player. Let's also look at the fact that both Hopkins and Hall have a better PPG than the leading scorer for the Flames. And of course the fact that these kids are all under the age of 21.

Finally, and most importantly, the differece between the Oilers and the Flames this year is 3 reg wins and seven overtime overtime losses.

I guess the idea of meaningful hockey games after Christmas is praying your team can hang on long enough to get an overtime point?? Yep, keep scraping out for that final playoff spot or miss the playoffs every year and enoy those middle of the road picks, when the moron GM's don't trade them away.

Yep, ignorant is a great word. Another that comes to mind is delusional.



Wait 5 yeas, is that Edmontons new moto?

I would hope Eberle would outscore any of the Flames, it's the difference between TEAM hockey and having one line. I think Eberle and Hopkins could be good Great hockey players, but I'm not sold on Hall yet. All those young guys played very well and they still finished at the bottom of the standings.

Oilers fans automatically think that they will be the next Blackhawks, I don't blame you if i were an oiler fan I would hope for that too, but that kind of thinking is what I would call DILUSIONAL.

Eberle is not Johnathan Towes, Hopkins is not Patick Kane. And you have no where near the the supporting cast they had. Sharp,Ladd,Byfuglien,Bolland,Versteeg,Keith,Campbell and goaltending to boot.

No I would compare the oilers more to a team like the Islanders. Sure you might have a John Taveras adn a bucnch of young guns in the line up but it's not enough. Until Edmonton can attract free agents, get some defence and goaltending they will continue to be an exciting team to watch that dosn't get to the playoffs.

You call Calgary a 'POOR' team for not being in the playoffs, I clearly showed you that they were an combined of 12 points out of the playoffs over the last 3 years, then you show that edmonton is 11 points behind the Flames this year alone. So if you class the flames as a 'POOR' team word could possibly discribe Edmonton?

See you in 5 years.



"Most of the guys that wear them are Europeans and French Guys."
Don Cherry on Visors
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@valanche
Rookie



Canada
240 Posts

Posted - 04/02/2012 :  07:33:41  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Clatts

Eberle is not Johnathan Towes, Hopkins is not Patick Kane. And you have no where near the the supporting cast they had. Sharp,Ladd,Byfuglien,Bolland,Versteeg,Keith,Campbell and goaltending to boot.




Eberle has more points and one less goal than toews got in his second year... he is elite and an incredible player i've seen him play in 3 different leagues and dominate each. i think RNH is much better than pat kane.
as for supporting cast i completely agree.

quote:
Originally posted by Beans15


It's not an ignorant statement to say this team is horrible. They are. Finishing 30th or 17th is still missing the playoffs, isn't it? Difference being is finishing 17th does not get talent prospects into the team.



eberle was drafted 22nd overall and may be better than anyone else on edmonton. with that being said high draft picks certainly increases your chances at success.

66 is > than 99
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Guest8384
( )

Posted - 04/02/2012 :  09:11:26  Reply with Quote
Slozo pretty sure this has nothing to do with your Leafs. Why are you posting here?
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8153 Posts

Posted - 04/02/2012 :  09:13:09  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
You hit the nail on the head when you did compare the supporting cast for the Oilers compared to the Blackhawks. The Oilers 3rd and 4th lines are not quality enough and their goaltending is weak. That, above having injuries to Hall, Eberle, RNH, Whitney, Hemsky, Horcoff, Potter, and Eager, was the reason the Oilers were so low in the standings this season.

That being said, I appreciate the way you dodge the point about how close the Oilers were to the Flames in wins. Talk all you want about 11 pts spread, the Flames have more points from OT and shootout loses than any team other than Florida.

The Flames are regressing (7 fewer wins and 8 less pts year over year) while the Oilers are improving (7 more wins and 11 more points). The Flames are the 2nd oldest team in the NHL and have a top 5 cap hit. The Oilers are one of the 5 youngest teams in the NHL with a mid-level cap hit.

Who is dilusional???


You won't see me in 5 years. The Flames we be near the bottom of the standings and the Oilers will be near the top. So far ahead you will not be able to see them at all!!!

I am done. Enjoy the same golf season as the Oilers and a draft pick 10 spots higher.........
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Clatts
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
266 Posts

Posted - 04/02/2012 :  12:15:32  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

You hit the nail on the head when you did compare the supporting cast for the Oilers compared to the Blackhawks. The Oilers 3rd and 4th lines are not quality enough and their goaltending is weak. That, above having injuries to Hall, Eberle, RNH, Whitney, Hemsky, Horcoff, Potter, and Eager, was the reason the Oilers were so low in the standings this season.

That being said, I appreciate the way you dodge the point about how close the Oilers were to the Flames in wins. Talk all you want about 11 pts spread, the Flames have more points from OT and shootout loses than any team other than Florida.

The Flames are regressing (7 fewer wins and 8 less pts year over year) while the Oilers are improving (7 more wins and 11 more points). The Flames are the 2nd oldest team in the NHL and have a top 5 cap hit. The Oilers are one of the 5 youngest teams in the NHL with a mid-level cap hit.

Who is dilusional???


You won't see me in 5 years. The Flames we be near the bottom of the standings and the Oilers will be near the top. So far ahead you will not be able to see them at all!!!

I am done. Enjoy the same golf season as the Oilers and a draft pick 10 spots higher.........



You really want to bring up injuries when Calgary is at the top of the list this year for man games missed? After this conversation im not sure you even watch hockey. Don't take about dodging points when you haven't answered any of my questions.

Anyway if your done thats fine. I do respect you however for picking a side and sticking with it and participating in the Battle of Alberta

"Most of the guys that wear them are Europeans and French Guys."
Don Cherry on Visors
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8153 Posts

Posted - 04/02/2012 :  15:09:54  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Do you have proof that Calgary lead the NHL in man games lost to injuries?? If you do, I am interested in seeing it. If that is the case than that does explain some of the Flames woes, there is no doubt.

That being said, I fail to see any of the questions you posed that I did not respond to. You brought up facts about the Flames missing the playoffs by a few points. So what? I didn't know there was a prize for missing the playoffs by the fewest points. I guess there is. The prize of always being a mediocre team.

If there is something out there I did not respond to, please let me know I will gladly respond. I would, however, appreciate a simple response to this question:

How is Calgary a better team than Edmonton when their records are Calgary with 35W-45L is 80 games and Edmonton has 32W-47L is 79 games??

I theory, Edmonton can win their next three games and Calgary lose their final 2 and both end up with the same record of wins and losses. That exact same record still give Edmonton an upper hand with those pesky OTL points giving Calgary around a 10th overall pick and the Oilers with 2-3 overall.

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Guest4178
( )

Posted - 04/02/2012 :  16:08:15  Reply with Quote
Calgary's last two meetings with Edmonton were not successful for the Flames in results (6-1 and 3-1 losses respectively), but also the subsequent funks which took place after each of their two losses to their Alberta rival.

In early February, the Flames had 5 wins, and 3 OTL points in 8 games (getting at least a point in each of these 8 games), and then met up with the Oilers, and got doused 6-1! The Flames went on to lose 6 of their next 7 games, which left them four points out of a playoff position.

The Flames then went on to win five consecutive games, putting them back in playoff contention, but this string of wins was broken by the Oilers who beat the Flames by a score of 3-1. Calgary did not rebound from this loss, going on to lose 7 of their next 8 games, which is where they sit today.

Counting the 3-1 loss to the Oilers, the Flames managed only 6 out of 18 possible points in their last nine games. If they could have mustered an extra 3 wins, the additional 6 points would have put them ahead of Phoenix, and in 7th place in the West.

Despite the apparent turning point losses to the Oilers (which is really just circumstantial), the Flames will miss the postseason for the same reason most teams miss the playoffs. They didn't get it done this season, and in their case, they fell apart down the stretch. They were in contention ten games ago, but with only one win in their last nine games, the Flames season has come to a disappointing end.
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Clatts
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
266 Posts

Posted - 04/02/2012 :  19:39:15  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
It's called Google Beans, if you don't know how to use it theres no helping you.

Wins and Losses don't matter in the NHL it's points, don't hate the player hate the game. Anyone who can honestly believe Edmonton is the better team can't be argued with.

The last time Edmonton beat Calgary in points? 2003

Last time Edmonton entered a playoff series as the favourite? 20 years or more

http://sports.nationalpost.com/2012/03/17/by-the-numbers-a-closer-look-at-nhl-man-games-lost-to-injury/

This list was last updated Mid March but as you can see:

Calgary 336 Man games lost
Edmonton 215 Man games Lost

So before you go putting blame on injuries

Only other team with more man games lost than Calgary is MTL with 356.

"Most of the guys that wear them are Europeans and French Guys."
Don Cherry on Visors
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Guest4377
( )

Posted - 04/02/2012 :  21:02:00  Reply with Quote
I'm not sure what the argument is, but if it's who's the better team this season, I give Calgary the slight edge. If it's who was the better team the past two games, it would be the Oilers with 6-1 and 3-1 wins.

If it's who was the better team the past ten seasons, I would give the nod to Calgary.

If it's which team has been the most successful franchise in their 30-year (approximate) histories, it's no contest. You start with cup wins (5-1 in favour of the Oilers), then you look at the number of players from each team in the Hall of Fame, then you look at individual award winners (Hart, Art Ross, Norris, etc.), and it's not even close sister! (Do you mind if I call you sister?)

And if you objectively look at which team has the brighter future, most people would say the Oilers.
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JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1854 Posts

Posted - 04/04/2012 :  13:28:45  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
This has become a which team sucks worst type post. I agree with the post that Calgary has lost a lot of games due to injuries and lack of depth when playing a man down. Looking thru the below stats neither team fairs well except in the special teams aspect of the game. Surprisingly both are low in the rankings at scoring 1st. Not surprisingly neither team does well when trailing the 1st period. Both teams lack the ability to compete in a game when the play from behind. Both are well below average in faceoffs, allow too many shots againts and have a low winning % when they outshoot opponents. But Calgary has that intangible to keep it close and to take it to overtime that Edmonton does not.

Most Wins ranking Calgary 22th Edmonton 28th

Most Loss Ranking Calgary 18th Edmonton 2nd

Otl Ranking Calgary 2nd Edmonton 19th

Points per game % Calgary 20th Edmonton 29th

Goals for Ranking Calgary 26th Edmonton 18th

Goals against Ranking Calgary 15th Edmonton 22nd

5 on 5 Ranking Calgary 27th Edmonton 23rd

Powerplay Ranking Calgary 13th Edmonton 2nd

Penalty Kill Ranking Calgary 9th Edmonton 14th

Shots for Ranking Calgary 25th Edmonton 29th

Shots against Ranking Calgary 24th Edmonton 20th

Faceoff Ranking Calgary 30th Edmonton 27th

Scoring first Ranking Calgary 22nd Edmonton 23rd

Win% Trailing after 1st Calgary 22nd Edmonton 28th

Win% When outshooting Calgary 18th Edmonton 24th

The way I figure it is in the current state of both Calgary is closer to a playoff team statistically. Add a few players to the Calgary roster who can score and lose the players with history of man games lost. Edmonton although they have the better offensive team need a dependable goalie, stronger defensive corp and is a longer ways away from being a serious contender for a playoff position.

Edited by - JOSHUACANADA on 04/04/2012 13:43:00
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