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leafsfan_101
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1530 Posts |
 Posted - 06/27/2007 : 16:50:23
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Gold Cup TV ratings 41 percent higher than NHL final
The United States' 2-1 come-from-behind victory over Mexico on Sunday received a 2.5 fast national rating on Univision, the network said Tuesday...Anaheim's series-ending 6-2 victory over Ottawa in the Stanley Cup on June 6 received a 1.8 rating on NBC, which comes to 2,005,000 households.
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This is horrible news. WE should fire Bettman here and now.
Second place is only first place of the losers.
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 06/27/2007 : 21:05:46
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How exactly is it Gary Bettman's fault that American's don't like hockey as much as other sports??
Soccer is the most popular sport in the world.
Is that Gary Bettman's fault??
The World Cup 2006 had over 12 million viewers in Canada
The 2006 Stanley Cup Finals average 2.8 million viewers.
Is that Gary Bettman's fault???
You also have to look at the populations of the US. There are over 40 million people from Hispanic desent in the US. That is more than all the population of Canada. It's a game between the US and Mexico, who do you think would be most interested in watching that??
But that must be Bettman's fault too???
Bettman has nothing to do with the NHL's lack of success in the States. You could put hockey on every channel, every day for ever and it still won't catch on there.
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane?? |
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Guest4024
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 00:08:55
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yeah, but there are many many other reasons why bettman should be fired. |
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juice32
Rookie
Canada
100 Posts |
Posted - 06/28/2007 : 07:15:08
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I've gotta agree with Beans here. I don't think its Bettmans fault that Americans like Soccer more then Hockey.
But I do agree that Bettman should be fired. This man lacks passion for the game. I think Mark Messier should take his place |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 06/28/2007 : 10:20:04
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Gary Bettman is one man in a large group of people who make decisions for the NHL. If you don't like the product on the ice, blame the competition committee. If you don't like the Marketing, blame the marketing department. Yes, Gary Bettman is the man who is resposible for all of these things, but he does not do all the work.
Let's look at his career since 1993 when he took over as Commisioner.
-Expansions under his watch were St. Paul, Atlanta, Nashville, and Columbus. This is the one area that could be questioned as these team have not been very successful and have not made money. But can you really pin business and personnel decisions of these teams on Bettman?
-Teams moved from Hartford, Winnipeg, Qubec City, and Minnesota, to Raleigh, Phoenix, Denver, and Dallas. (Each team that moved except for Phoenix has won the Cup since their move)
A 5 year TV deal with Fox occured under his watch.
NHL players started playing in the Olympics under his watch.
He brought in a hard cap of 54% of league revenue for players salaries, something that the NBA and MLB commisioners have not been able to do. This creates economic viability to the league.
So what has he done so poorly that justifies the need to fire him??
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane?? |
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Mikhailova
PickupHockey All-Star
USA
2918 Posts |
Posted - 06/28/2007 : 11:41:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Expansions under his watch were St. Paul, Atlanta, Nashville, and Columbus. This is the one area that could be questioned as these team have not been very successful and have not made money
Agreed except for St. Paul. Granted the Wild haven't won the Cup, but they've been doing alright otherwise. And not made money?? It's Minnesota, fans flock to see hockey games. They're doing fine financially.
quote:
-Teams moved from Hartford, Winnipeg, Qubec City, and Minnesota, to Raleigh, Phoenix, Denver, and Dallas. (Each team that moved except for Phoenix has won the Cup since their move)
So? Winning the Cup is the work of the team, the coach, and the GM, not Bettman. Just because they were successful doesn't mean it was a good move. If you ask me, moving teams out of hockey towns to sunny states is a dumb move. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 06/28/2007 : 17:10:27
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MIk what would you rather have: a team in a sunny state or no team at all??
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane?? |
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stastnysforever
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
301 Posts |
Posted - 06/28/2007 : 20:46:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
MIk what would you rather have: a team in a sunny state or no team at all??
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane??
The nords move to colorado wasn't that bad, colorado has quite a few hockey fans,
ps. im a wearing a nords tshirt and hat rite now
what do Calgary and a tea bag have in common- they're both only good for one cup |
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willus3
Moderator
Canada
1948 Posts |
Posted - 06/29/2007 : 06:11:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
So what has he done so poorly that justifies the need to fire him??
2 lockouts and the dead puck era come to mind.
"You are not your desktop wallpaper" |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 06/29/2007 : 09:25:45
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Hey Willus, do you think that Bettman was responsible for those things?? I can't see how he is at fault for teams playing the trap and for owners paying player dedonkulous contracts.
I just think that it was more he was the leader while these things happened more so than he was directly responsible for these things.
And has he not done a decent job recovering from those things??
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane?? |
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willus3
Moderator
Canada
1948 Posts |
Posted - 06/29/2007 : 11:08:24
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Hey Willus, do you think that Bettman was responsible for those things?? I can't see how he is at fault for teams playing the trap and for owners paying player dedonkulous contracts.
I just think that it was more he was the leader while these things happened more so than he was directly responsible for these things.
And has he not done a decent job recovering from those things??
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane??
It should never have come to two lockouts. Ever. That it did is absolutely his fault.
He is responsible for the product on the ice ie.For the oversize goalie equipment and the clutching and grabbing.
Yes it is Bettman who is ultimately responsible.
"You are not your desktop wallpaper" |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 06/29/2007 : 12:02:13
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Interesting perspective.
My thoughts are that yes, he could have done things to change the product on the ice to not have the dead puck era. I can agree that he could have changed that.
However, I think the lock outs had to happen. If not, the league would have turned into a different version on MLB. Only a couple of teams really competing and everyone else in the average area. Also, how many small market teams would have not been around without some kind of economic certainty??
I think Bettman was totally right with the lock outs.
And interesting that it was Bob Goodenow was the NHLPA head for both lock outs. Who is the one who still has their job??
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane?? |
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willus3
Moderator
Canada
1948 Posts |
Posted - 06/29/2007 : 15:02:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Interesting perspective.
My thoughts are that yes, he could have done things to change the product on the ice to not have the dead puck era. I can agree that he could have changed that.
However, I think the lock outs had to happen. If not, the league would have turned into a different version on MLB. Only a couple of teams really competing and everyone else in the average area. Also, how many small market teams would have not been around without some kind of economic certainty??
I think Bettman was totally right with the lock outs.
And interesting that it was Bob Goodenow was the NHLPA head for both lock outs. Who is the one who still has their job??
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane??
Did you as a fan enjoy the 1 and a half seasons without hockey? Is it fair that some players were robbed of their peak years?
There is no reason it had to come to a lockout either time. He was power tripping both times. Why would it take an entire season to resolve the issues they had? Ridiculous.
"You are not your desktop wallpaper" |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 07/01/2007 : 07:54:31
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Willus, are you not being just a little ignorant of the player's responsibility in those 1 1/2 years without hockey??
And as a hockey fan I was fine with the lock outs. I would much rather have 1 1/2 years without hockey than the league shutting down. Or losing my home team. Without the Lock Out and the economic certainties that it provided, it was a sure thing that Edmonton would have folded and/or moved.
Players come and go my man, but teams are for ever.
The lock outs had to happen.
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane?? |
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Mikhailova
PickupHockey All-Star
USA
2918 Posts |
Posted - 07/01/2007 : 08:11:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Players come and go my man, but teams are for ever.
Like Winnipeg, Quebec City, and Hartford? |
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willus3
Moderator
Canada
1948 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2007 : 06:19:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Willus, are you not being just a little ignorant of the player's responsibility in those 1 1/2 years without hockey??
And as a hockey fan I was fine with the lock outs. I would much rather have 1 1/2 years without hockey than the league shutting down. Or losing my home team. Without the Lock Out and the economic certainties that it provided, it was a sure thing that Edmonton would have folded and/or moved.
Players come and go my man, but teams are for ever.
The lock outs had to happen.
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane??
The players are by no means innocent.
I don't disagree that there were good things that came out of it in the end. The cap was needed as you say. (Though it seems it didn't last long with the new cap limit being 50M now) But Bettman should have been able to get it done without the lockout.
Overall I just don't believe him to be of good character. The word weasel always comes to mind when talking about him.
"You are not your desktop wallpaper" |
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stastnysforever
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
301 Posts |
Posted - 07/02/2007 : 16:31:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Mikhailova
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Players come and go my man, but teams are for ever.
Like Winnipeg, Quebec City, and Hartford?
touché
what do Calgary and a tea bag have in common- they're both only good for one cup |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 07/03/2007 : 09:21:20
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Hey Mik, would you rather have a team move or the team fold?? It's still a team is it not??
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane?? |
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PuckNuts
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2414 Posts |
Posted - 07/03/2007 : 10:05:46
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The first year after the Lockout the NHL set an attendance record...
We may have all missed hockey during the two lockouts but the NHL as a league is much stronger, and balanced as any team has a chance to win the Cup now...
I do net see how their could have been a salary cap without a lockout, the players did not want it but the League needed it...The lockout ensued and the players lost a year salary, some retired, and yes there is a Cap...They could have agreed to a cap earlier, and no lockout would have occurred...
Hate him or like him the League has a better chance of survival now...
I don't necessarily agree with everything I say.
- - Marshall McLuhan
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Mikhailova
PickupHockey All-Star
USA
2918 Posts |
Posted - 07/03/2007 : 10:12:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
It's still a team is it not??
Yeah, but it's not the same team. The Phoenix Coyotes are not the Winnipeg Jets. I just meant that since the original team is no longer around where it once was, so in that area the team wasn't forever. |
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manninm
PickupHockey Pro
USA
347 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2007 : 08:05:46
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Attendance does not directly dictate the performance of a sporting league. Granted, I think the league is sustainable now. The fact remains the 10 years prior to the lockout were a downward spiral with the end result almost being the league getting flushed down the toilet.
When Bettman took over the league was steadily rising. His first couple years the league continued to rise, but after the lockout in 1994-95, things deteriorated. The migration of franchises to atypical markets and expansion have all had catastrophic effects on the league. The new markets have not embraced hockey, and expansion (and many rule changes) resulted in the "soccerization effect," causing the game to be watered down and dull. Only in the past couple years has he done anything positive for the game.
His ideas have proven time and time again to hurt the game in the long run. The fact that he hadn't been fired in the late-90's or early 2000's is a travesty.
Because the demands on a goalie are mostly mental, it means that for a goalie, the biggest enemy is himself." ~Ken Dryden |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2007 : 09:07:21
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If attendance does not dicate the performance of the league then what does??
And again, where is the player's responsibility in this? Bettman couldn't create all these problems on his own.
And please be specific on what decisons he has made directly that have hurt the game in the long run??
And by the way, I am not a huge Gary Bettman fan, I just don't see how he is doing such a bad job that he should get fired.
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane?? |
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manninm
PickupHockey Pro
USA
347 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2007 : 12:49:12
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Let me rephrase...attendance does not necessarily indicate well being and growth of a sport. Granted, it's all how you look at it. My viewpoint is that the NHL is a far cry away from where it was 15 years ago. In the early 90's it was contending with Baseball and Basketball and just below football in terms of popularity. Now it's a "super regional" sport and NASCAR has surpassed it with regards to popularity.
The players have some responsibility, but their greed should only affect the league's financial performance so far. If Bettman had done what he did 2 years ago in 94-95, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
Decisionmaking included not having the testicular fortitude to push forward with the cap and revenue sharing in 94-95, the instigator rule, which purists would argue takes away from the game, as well as, as mixed martial arts has proven, takes away from TV ratings as well, relocation to southern cities, which has proven to be mild failure, and expansion, which has diluted the talent pool.
I think he did enough to get fired in his first 12 years as commish. I actually think he's done well the past couple years and may have fixed some of the potentially catastrophic problems he created. We'll see what happens in the future (and if he allows an owner to buy Nashville and move it, and shuts his trap about the enlarging the nets).
Because the demands on a goalie are mostly mental, it means that for a goalie, the biggest enemy is himself." ~Ken Dryden |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2007 : 12:56:35
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Very solid points.
I agree that expansion has weakened the talent pool. Same thing happened in 67 and 78.
And I totally agree. If Bettman would have done in 94 what he did in 04, the league would be much better for it.
Instigator rule. Well, not sure if you can pin that on him. Did that not come from the competition committee which is a join NHL/NHLPA thing??
WIden the nets and I'll be the one to cast the first stone at Bettman.
I think you said it dead on. FIrst 12 years were crap, last three were good.
I Love your Kids, IHC is the man, and The Oilers Rule. Does that make me insane?? |
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The reason why Bettman should be fired 
