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Allow Anonymous Posting forum... Anaheim
 ANA signs Perry, 8yr/69M Allow Anonymous Users Reply to This Topic...
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Guest9251
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Posted - 03/19/2013 :  09:00:28  Reply with Quote
Anaheim really showing other NHL clubs that they aren't letting their superstars hit the UFA market. With Getzlaf and Perry both locked up for a long term how do you think they will do going forward and will they have the cap space to be a winning team in the future?

In my opinion, Bobby Ryan will be traded (for sure this time) in the offseason after the Ducks go for a cup run. Keep in mind the Fins, Selanne, Koivu and Lydman are all UFAs at the end of this season, as well as a few RFAs the Ducks have.

just1n
Rookie



244 Posts

Posted - 03/19/2013 :  09:29:23  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I can see why the NHL wanted to limit contract lengths. I can't imagine how ridiculous these deals would be otherwise!

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Guest4377
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Posted - 03/21/2013 :  22:25:04  Reply with Quote
I still remember when Oilers GM Kevin Lowe had Corey Perry coming to Edmonton for Mike Comrie back in 2003. Anaheim was good to do the deal, but Lowe threw a wrench in the deal (after all other terms were agreed upon) by asking Comrie to put in a substantial amount of money (reported to be as much as $2.5 million) to consummate the deal.

This was an unprecedented move, and the deal was nixed by Comrie, his dad, and his agent.

The Oilers ended up trading Comrie (who was holding out at the time) to the Flyers forJeff Woywitka and draft picks that turned into Rob Schremp and Danny Syvret.

Hindsight is easy though, and one can take the "butterfly effect" and project that if Perry joined the Oilers back in 2003, they wouldn't be the same team today, due to the Oilers place in the standings, draft picks, etc.

But to nix a trade on the basis Lowe did 10 years ago, where making Comrie pay (figuratively and literally) was not a good hockey move. You can give Lowe credit for putting the trade together, but he never should have asked Comrie to ante up to make the deal happen.

That's making things personal, and the Oilers ended up losing out on acquiring a great hockey player!




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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8153 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2013 :  11:47:55  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The Oilers also made a trade with Boston for Sergei Samsanov for Marty Reasoner and a draft pick that turned into Milan Lucic. The Oilers also passed on Zach Parise in the 2003 draft by trading the 17th spot with NJ. After playing in the Q with Sidney Crosby the Oilers figured MA Pouliot was a lock for NHL success.

Every team can look back on deals and see how poorly they turned out while others were simply amazing. We all know the stories of the guys like Pavel Datsuyk or Henrik Zetterberg getting drafted in later rounds or trades like Luongo to FLA for Mark Parrish that turned out horrible.



Speaking specifically about Perry, I think Anaheim will regret this deal as I think Perry is a one shot pony as a Richard winner. He is a solid player and deserves pay in the elite level of the NHL, but to be one of 8-10 players making more than $8 million is absurd. All this does is give hundred's of agents reasons to salivate when lesser players will have similar numbers to Perry and hold that $8million gun to the head of the owner.

Overpayment by $2 million/season in my opinion.
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Guest4178
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Posted - 03/22/2013 :  12:23:55  Reply with Quote
Agreed lots of teams can look back at trades they could have or should have made (or not made), but has there ever been a deal like the one, where a GM asked a player to pony up money to make a deal?

That's what's so unique about the Comrie-Perry trade that never happened!

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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5692 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2013 :  15:16:13  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
4178.....I don't recall that deal, nor do i think it's ever happened before. Since reading your post earlier this afternoon, i'm still laughing!

Beans.....I agree that he's overpaid, but lets face it, if Anaheim didn't give him that money, some other team would have for sure! I agree that he'll prob not win another Richard, but that's got more to do with Stamkos and others than it does himself! He may hit 50+ again? But i'm betting on other hitting the 60 range like Stamkos did last year.

As far as it being a career year, yeah, it may have been. But we all know Daniel Sedin should have won the Hart that year anyway.
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Guest4377
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Posted - 03/22/2013 :  16:53:28  Reply with Quote
Does anyone find it odd that the Ducks gave Perry $3 million more than Getzlaf?

I know $3 million is insignificant (in relative terms), but the optics in giving one guy $66 million and another guy $69 million (over the same term - 8 years) kinda says one player is a bit more valuable than the other.

In my opinion, the two players values are comparable, but I would give a slight edge to Getzlaf.

Getzlaf has 507 points in 541 games (.94 points per game) in his career so far, while Perry has 453 points in 555 games (.82 points per game.) When looking at the past three seasons, the players are about the same in points per game. (Getlzlaf at .94 and Perry at .91.) And so far this season, Getzlaf has 35 points in 29 games compared to Perry, who has 24 points in 25 games.

For physical play, both players have size (Getzlaf is a bit bigger at 6'4" and 221 pounds, one inch taller than Perry, and about 10-15 pounds heavier), and for how they play, I think Getlaf is a bit stronger with the puck.

As for age, these two players are almost twins, born six days apart, both players turn 28 in May.

So why did the Ducks give Perry an extra $375k per season. Well maybe it's because he won the Hart Trophy a few seasons ago?

Or maybe the Ducks value goals more than assists? Perry has 214 goals compared to Getlaf's 148, but Getzlaf has 359 assists compared to Perry's 239 assists.

Last time I looked, assists were recognized the same as goals.

That being said, why does the NHL give a trophy out to the player who scores the most goals, but not one for the player who gets the most assists?



When lo
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5692 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2013 :  20:11:28  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Great points 4377. I've argued with friends in the past about these two guys and if i had my choice and was starting a team, i'd pick Getzlaf over Perry. Sure, it's easy to say a team like Pittsburgh would prefer to have Perry as they're deep at center, but that's why i qualified my choice with "if i were starting a team". Positional needs are obviously key here as these two don't play the same spots!

Funny, i've seen talk about the Olympic team for 2014 and Perry is talked about over Getzlaf by most, however, Canada is so deep at center, i'm not surprised!

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JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1854 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2013 :  10:42:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
That's a good question. Do you pay more for a goal scorer or a playmaker. I would assume the goalscorer got paid more based on it being harder to find a 50 goal scoring player than a ppg player, but between these 2 players its pretty close value based on better ppg for Getzlaf. If I were building a team I and I had to choose between the 2, I'd be tempted to take the centerman with almost a ppg, over the winger with 50 goals in a season. But obviously Anaheim values Perry more.
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Guest2104
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Posted - 03/23/2013 :  11:38:51  Reply with Quote
Last year with 37 goals Perry was the highest goal scorer in the Western Conference. The reason I believe Perry is getting paid more is because he was really thinking about hitting the UFA market where he'd get $9M, whereas Getzlaf was planning on signing with the Ducks the whole time(wife's from Cali, just had another kid). Also a big part of Perry resigning with the Ducks was that Getzlaf did. These guys will put up more points together than separated, losing one of them would be like splitting up the Sedins, but not as far to that extent.
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3562 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2013 :  12:18:20  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest2104

Last year with 37 goals Perry was the highest goal scorer in the Western Conference. The reason I believe Perry is getting paid more is because he was really thinking about hitting the UFA market where he'd get $9M, whereas Getzlaf was planning on signing with the Ducks the whole time(wife's from Cali, just had another kid). Also a big part of Perry resigning with the Ducks was that Getzlaf did. These guys will put up more points together than separated, losing one of them would be like splitting up the Sedins, but not as far to that extent.



9M, come on! I read somewhere that teams that pay their top 2 players 15M combined cannot be contenders, so what team is going to pay Perry 9M and instantly take themselves out of the running for the cup?
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Guest4209
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Posted - 03/23/2013 :  13:29:38  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
9M, come on! I read somewhere that teams that pay their top 2 players 15M combined cannot be contenders, so what team is going to pay Perry 9M and instantly take themselves out of the running for the cup?

No 25% of your cap on only two players that play on the same line won't be contenders. Just watch how difficult a time Anaheim will have to sign any secondary scoring if Selanne and Koivu don't take a home town discount next year.

If you take Bobby Ryan into account, that is sometimes 33% of your cap on a single line (not often this year but based on previous years). Good luck building the rest of your forwards with anything but rookies or off casts of other teams.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4515 Posts

Posted - 03/25/2013 :  07:13:28  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4209

quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
9M, come on! I read somewhere that teams that pay their top 2 players 15M combined cannot be contenders, so what team is going to pay Perry 9M and instantly take themselves out of the running for the cup?

No 25% of your cap on only two players that play on the same line won't be contenders. Just watch how difficult a time Anaheim will have to sign any secondary scoring if Selanne and Koivu don't take a home town discount next year.

If you take Bobby Ryan into account, that is sometimes 33% of your cap on a single line (not often this year but based on previous years). Good luck building the rest of your forwards with anything but rookies or off casts of other teams.



Only one other team pays two guys more than Anaheim now - the Pittsburgh Penguins, with Crosby and Malkin. Now, those are two players that personally would have no problem doing that with, for obvious reasons . . .

. . . but the point is well made, I think Anaheim has too much invested here in two guys, ESPECIALLY with a LOWER CAP (!!!) coming next year.

Ryan is as good as gone . . . and I see a hockey trade with decent player value coming back to Anaheim in the form of solid players in their line-up.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3562 Posts

Posted - 03/25/2013 :  09:04:52  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by slozo

quote:
Originally posted by Guest4209

quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
9M, come on! I read somewhere that teams that pay their top 2 players 15M combined cannot be contenders, so what team is going to pay Perry 9M and instantly take themselves out of the running for the cup?

No 25% of your cap on only two players that play on the same line won't be contenders. Just watch how difficult a time Anaheim will have to sign any secondary scoring if Selanne and Koivu don't take a home town discount next year.

If you take Bobby Ryan into account, that is sometimes 33% of your cap on a single line (not often this year but based on previous years). Good luck building the rest of your forwards with anything but rookies or off casts of other teams.



Only one other team pays two guys more than Anaheim now - the Pittsburgh Penguins, with Crosby and Malkin. Now, those are two players that personally would have no problem doing that with, for obvious reasons . . .

. . . but the point is well made, I think Anaheim has too much invested here in two guys, ESPECIALLY with a LOWER CAP (!!!) coming next year.

Ryan is as good as gone . . . and I see a hockey trade with decent player value coming back to Anaheim in the form of solid players in their line-up.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug



The % of money given to these guys as a percentage of current payroll does not differ much:

- 2012: Getzlaf/Perry/Ryan 15.75M, ANA payroll 55.8M, 28% .
- money for all other players: 40M
- 2013: same 3, 21.9M, cap 64.3M, 34%
- money for all other players: 42M

I am comparing current payroll to future cap limit - the new reality for ANA will be that they'll be forced to spend to the cap next year, which they can probably afford to do given the increased revenues they'll get from the new CBA.

Even with the increased spend by ANA next year on their top 3 players, they'll have a little bit more money to spend on the rest of their team. I'm just not seeing much of a problem for ANA...at least on paper.
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