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Ryan Harper
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
322 Posts |
 Posted - 11/02/2006 : 10:03:53
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I know this is a touchy subject and I want to keep the bigotry and racism out of it but I found this article very interesting and wanted to bring it up here. Even though its in trash talk - lets try to be adults about it. Read and comment:
Well-known lawyer wants a Team Quebec at the 2008 world hockey tournament
QUEBEC (CP) - A well-known Quebec lawyer is urging Premier Jean Charest to get involved in helping to create a Team Quebec that would play in the 2008 world hockey championships.
Guy Bertrand says it would be fitting to have such a team because part of the 2008 tournament will be played in Quebec City.
Bertrand says Hockey Canada has told him Quebec can't have a team because it is not a country.
But the lawyer, who has embraced sovereignty again after a six-year flirt with federalism, says Quebec is a nation that has the right to be represented at international tournaments.
Part of the 2008 worlds will also be played in Halifax.
"Some people skate to the puck. I skate to where the puck is going to be."
~Wayne Gretzky
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bablaboushka
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2417 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 10:23:10
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Is Quebec a country?
No.
There's your answer buddy. We can't start splitting Canada up into regions, even though some probably could compete with, if not beat most other countries. Whether it's Quebec with their sovereignty babble or any other province/region, the competition is an international one. Key on INTER and NATION, it's not an interregional one. |
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Ryan Harper
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
322 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 10:46:59
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Sure but look at the former country: the U.S.S.R. It contained a number of different nations which are now independant countries. Czechoslovakia was one country composed of two different nations. Now they are independant from one another. I think you are right that it comes down to the fact that Quebec is not its own country. But Roughly 50% view Quebec as a separate nation. It is a debate that has been going on long before I was born. Reny Levesque and the FLQ. Meech Lake, Referendums etc. I just found the fact that this lawyer is making it a hockey issue quite amusing.
"Some people skate to the puck. I skate to where the puck is going to be."
~Wayne Gretzky
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Reiko24
Top Prospect
22 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 11:19:28
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Quebec is not a country but it is a distinct nation
I would like to see it happen but it won't happen |
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Novie
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
452 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 11:46:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Ryan Harper
Sure but look at the former country: the U.S.S.R. It contained a number of different nations which are now independant countries. Czechoslovakia was one country composed of two different nations. Now they are independant from one another. I think you are right that it comes down to the fact that Quebec is not its own country. But Roughly 50% view Quebec as a separate nation.
Let me start with response to your point: While he USSR was still one country, it sent one team to international competitions. It was one team at he olympics, etc etc. Once the country split up, THEN they sent seperate teams. Same with Czech and Slovak. They were regarded as two seperate regions long before they were sending 2 seperate groups to international competitions.
And the fact that it is being held in Quebec? Partially? Should Vancouver get it's own team to enter at the 2010 Olympics now? They're taking this too far!
Now that I have that point on the table, let me say this: Canada will be better off if (when?) Quebec seperates. They are our Terrell Owens. Yes, they bring a lot of positives to the 'team', but they are still ultimately out for themselves. I feel bad for my family still in Nova Scotia because they will be technically cut off from the rest of the country if that happens, but that's another topic altogether!
I'm starting to babble....but I think I made my point. Until the borders are visible on a map, they won't have thir own team.
Go Sens |
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nazzy_19
Top Prospect
Canada
57 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 12:30:36
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If a nationwide referendum can't split Quebec from the rest of Canada, a Hockey Tournament isn't going to have a chance. Although the sport is embraced much like religion in other countries around the world, there's no way that this would be seen as a 'positive' for Hockey, or Canada in general.
I'll keep the add-on remarks to myself...
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ultimatetitman
Rookie
Canada
244 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 13:43:07
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I certainly agree that Quebec is NOT a country and therefore should not be allowed to participate as such.
However, this is a hockey tournament, not a political forum. And for the sake of the game, I would love to see it. Quebec could submit a great team, certainly better than Germany or Switzerland (Yes, I am fully aware of what happened at the Olympics). It would raise the bar, so to speak, and make it more fun to watch. Imagine the fun (and tension) a Canada vs. Quebec game would generate.
Besides, which would you rather see, Crosby bearing down of Theodore, or Heatley dekeing his way past Ratislav Stana?
Look at their potential roster: Lecavalier, St. Louis, Brodeur, Luongo, Gagné. And that's just off the top of my head.
As much as I would HATE the political ramifications, as a hockey fan, I'm all for it. |
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bablaboushka
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2417 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 15:08:54
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Ok hypothetically Quebec gets awarded the right to have its own team:
Ontario says what the hell we want a team too. And why wouldn't they, they could be as competitive as Quebec (Thornton, Spezza, Nash, Jovo, Pronger, Fernandez, Turco to name a few).
I mean if you say yes to one you set precedent and well, it could get ugly if others wanted to play off of that.
It's not even about hockey. This is entirely political and a bunch of separatist groups will probably see this as fuel to re-ignite their rage. Using the fact that Quebec is one of the venues as a reason to get a team there is purely ridiculous. If they want to play it that way, let's Halifax get a team here. We'd have Crosby, Ollie Kolzig might qualify cause he was raised here, Joey MacDonald as a backup, Joe DiPenta was raised here... So we wouldn't be amazing but hey, why not? We ARE a venue right... |
Edited by - bablaboushka on 11/02/2006 15:15:14 |
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Novie
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
452 Posts |
Posted - 11/03/2006 : 05:13:01
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quote:
Originally posted by bablaboushka
Ok hypothetically Quebec gets awarded the right to have its own team:
Ontario says what the hell we want a team too. And why wouldn't they, they could be as competitive as Quebec (Thornton, Spezza, Nash, Jovo, Pronger, Fernandez, Turco to name a few).
I mean if you say yes to one you set precedent and well, it could get ugly if others wanted to play off of that.
It's not even about hockey. This is entirely political and a bunch of separatist groups will probably see this as fuel to re-ignite their rage. Using the fact that Quebec is one of the venues as a reason to get a team there is purely ridiculous. If they want to play it that way, let's Halifax get a team here. We'd have Crosby, Ollie Kolzig might qualify cause he was raised here, Joey MacDonald as a backup, Joe DiPenta was raised here... So we wouldn't be amazing but hey, why not? We ARE a venue right...
First off...you're from Halifax? Same here (as if the name didn't give that away!)
And yes, what about a Wstern Canada team? and the different parts of Russia would likely want seperate teams...Team Moscow?
I think we have killed this one....the stupid lawyers can do all they want with the tournament, but come gameday, I'm only cheering for one team:
GO SENS
haha...oops...I mean...GO CANADA!
Go Sens |
Edited by - Novie on 11/03/2006 16:18:34 |
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Guest4044
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Posted - 11/03/2006 : 22:22:06
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Leave it to the lawyers (who get paid to do so) to take a black and white issue and grey it all out. No country, no invite. But my rec league is having a tournie in January that is open to all Canadians so they can put in their own team if they want....or can they?
My point is, until Quebec actually separates (if it does) then Quebec borm players are Canadians and therefore must play on a "Canadian" team. |
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Myles06-07
Top Prospect
91 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2006 : 19:24:13
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Go ahead with a team Quebec.
Hope they get there asses kicked. |
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framer87
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
338 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2006 : 17:21:32
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If there is a Team Quebec why isnt there a team Onatario or a Team Western CAnada plus there not a country so NO. But as people before have said they would have a great team and it would be fun to watch a Canada vs. Quebec game but its still not fair to put in a team Quebec when there not even a country.
Go pens |
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bablaboushka
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2417 Posts |
Posted - 12/09/2006 : 08:13:46
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But they're a "Nation within a nation", what a croc.
I also have a much more commonly used term for those... "Province". |
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1 Crosby fan
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1454 Posts |
Posted - 12/09/2006 : 23:55:48
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framer87
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
338 Posts |
Posted - 12/10/2006 : 15:29:34
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LOL
Go pens |
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1 Crosby fan
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1454 Posts |
Posted - 12/10/2006 : 15:43:18
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| LOL |
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Guest4292
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Posted - 12/14/2006 : 15:32:03
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| we should have team Quebec for sure we're a nation and we would be much better than team canada cause without quebecers team canada is not very hot |
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Mikhailova
PickupHockey All-Star
USA
2918 Posts |
Posted - 12/14/2006 : 15:43:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest4292
we should have team Quebec for sure we're a nation and we would be much better than team canada cause without quebecers team canada is not very hot
Come on, hockey was invented in Canada, it's your tradition. The national team would be great with or without the players from Quebec. BTW if you're from there you're Quebecois, not a Quebecer. |
Edited by - Mikhailova on 12/14/2006 15:44:20 |
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Guest4292
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Posted - 12/14/2006 : 19:19:31
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quebecers quebecois its the same
by the way what will your team Canada look like without
Brodeur, lecavalier stlouis luongo dumont beauchemin phaneuf gagné
briere pominville brindamour savard bergeron bouchard giguere
come on man the best players come from Quebec without a doubt
the best player of all time is mario lemieux and the best goalie ever is patrick roy so I think we've done our part in hockey history and we will continue to carry on this legacy |
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bablaboushka
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2417 Posts |
Posted - 12/14/2006 : 19:21:56
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| And yet you're a Canadian province. |
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Guest4187
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Posted - 12/14/2006 : 19:46:45
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Not sure it'll be a good idea to have a Quebec team in an international tournament. It would make a precedent. And the Quebec's team would be pretty average (defense would be very miserable), and the Canadian one would be a bit worse too (goalie, maybe offense).
Why not make a Canadian "B" team instead?
btw: message to Guest4272: Brind'amour and Phaneuf are not from Quebec. We often saw Patrick Marleau in the list too, but he was born in Saskatchewan. And please, don't put Beauchemin and Pominville on your list, it's a shame... |
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Guest4292
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Posted - 12/14/2006 : 20:23:07
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hahaah canadian b
good idea |
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Mikhailova
PickupHockey All-Star
USA
2918 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2006 : 13:14:34
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Dude--Sakic, Recchi, and CROSBY are not fom Quebec and they're essential players to team Canada (well, Crosby would be if he were on it). And Gretzky wasn't from Quebec either and everyone knows he's the greatest player of all time, not Lemieux.
Not that Quebecois players aren't good, but it's not like Canada would suffer without them. |
Edited by - Mikhailova on 12/15/2006 13:17:15 |
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Mikhailova
PickupHockey All-Star
USA
2918 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2006 : 13:19:10
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quote:
Originally posted by bablaboushka
And yet you're a Canadian province.
Exactly. Quebec would not have such great hockey players if it were not part of Canada, where the game was invented. |
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Guest4134
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Posted - 12/16/2006 : 10:17:58
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No offence to any other provinces but i think quebec comes with some of the best hokcey players in canada. brodeur latendresse even angelo esposito is going to get drafted next year |
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ED11
Rookie
Canada
224 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2006 : 10:42:29
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| Let me just say this. There is WAY too much discussion about this. Quebec is NOT A COUNRTY....therefore they are part of Canada. PERIOD. Man, everyone is talking about the players being better from there and all this when they are CANADIAN. What concept do people not understand here???? Ask the players themselves where they would want to play and I am willing to bet any amount of money that they would ALL say that representing Canada is what they love to do. By the way to that guest. Gretzky is the best hockey player ever. Say what you want, but first go look at his stats year by year and then say otherwise... |
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bablaboushka
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2417 Posts |
Posted - 12/16/2006 : 11:55:56
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| Of course Quebec comes with some of the best players in Canada, they're the biggest province and the second most populated. It's just a big numbers game. But the simple fact is that Quebec is part of Canada end of story. Canada was founded from the four original provinces that made up Upper and Lower Canada (NB, NS, QC and ON). Remember that Jacques Cartier dude? Yeah, guess where he landed and settled over 400 years ago... Quebec was the foundation on which Canada was built and now talks have arisen about separating, but if they can't have that now they want their own hockey team? Even if it might be so stereotypical of Canadians to use a silly hockey team as a metaphor for what is really a political debate, the fact is that we are a multi-cultural melting pot where many peoples may find peace and freedom. Quebec doesn't get a special exemption. |
Edited by - bablaboushka on 12/16/2006 11:56:38 |
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Mikhailova
PickupHockey All-Star
USA
2918 Posts |
Posted - 12/17/2006 : 08:53:23
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From the article: Bertrand says Hockey Canada has told him Quebec can't have a team because it is not a country.
That sums it up, enough said. Quebec is part of CANADA and not an independent nation. There's no solid reason to say otherwise. |
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Guest4292
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Posted - 12/18/2006 : 11:31:10
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| maurice richard |
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DTH
Top Prospect
Canada
3 Posts |
Posted - 12/26/2006 : 23:41:15
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Gretzky, the best all time player? Are you forgetting Maurice Richard? Of course, he's just a quebecois!
All the reasons why Quebec can't have a team:
- Canada will loss a good asset to his team.
- A rivalery between the team Canada and Team Quebec will just provoke more and more confontration and anti-quebec/anti-canada racissicism...
- The decision will be up to Jean Charest (federalist), or if it goes that far, to the Canadian governement.
- Split Team Canada in half...yeah a metaphor of the Quebec's situation...not good for Canada's politic...
- 2x more budget!
- Quebec is not a country, and it's not because we (quebecois) don't want it, that's only because there's too much imported-with-canadian-care people in Canada (a little out of subject, sorry.)
- There's only one canadian (well, I correct myself, anglo-canadians :P ) that see us as a nation...
Well, we can just forget that, for the sake of Canada's glory...
Just a simple (and free) comment. Personnaly, I don't want the Quebec to be separated from Canada...I just want us to be separated from Ontario! :D Just kiddin' (with Bon cop bad cop, I see the Ontario a way much different from before...) |
Edited by - DTH on 12/26/2006 23:42:19 |
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Lawyer wants a Team Quebec at the Worlds 
