| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Guest8888
( )
|
|
|
leafsfan_101
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1530 Posts |
 Posted - 01/27/2007 : 15:01:28
|
Jason Smith- $1,976,000.00
M.A. Bergeron-$969,000.00
Marco Sturm- $2,100,000.00
Brad Stuart-$2,400,000.00
Edmonton cannot hold the extra money in that deal. Their payroll is hovering around the $43 Million mark and the don't have the money to support stuart and Sturm.
~You play to win the Game~ Herm Edwards |
 |
|
|
Guest8888
( )
|
Posted - 01/27/2007 : 15:04:29
|
| Would the Oilers pick up all of Stuarts contract though? |
|
|
|
lyall
PickupHockey Pro
360 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2007 : 21:59:32
|
| They should go for it. |
|
|
|
-oil-country-
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
988 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2007 : 09:12:30
|
| They don't need another forward and Bergeron is a great player on the Powerplay (ya Stuart is too) and Smith is a great defensive defenseman and is one of the league leaders in Blocked Shots. But where would Sturm fit? We sat Nedved last night if we get Sturm than who would we sit? Torres,Thorensen,Reasoner? |
|
|
|
lyall
PickupHockey Pro
360 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2007 : 09:17:16
|
| But all Jason Smith does is lay on the ice & take bad penalties. If we trade him some changes will happen due to the change in leardership. |
Edited by - lyall on 01/28/2007 09:17:52 |
|
|
|
KariyaSelanne
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
297 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2007 : 09:34:21
|
If they trade Jason Smith, Ryan Smyth will become captain like it should be.
Go Preds Go!!! |
|
|
|
-oil-country-
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
988 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2007 : 10:25:57
|
ya good point but i still don't think we need another forward.
|
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2007 : 11:00:55
|
I doubt this will happen. If it does, it will surprise me. Smith and Bergeron are both under contract that Stuart and Sturm are both UFA's this year. I agree that Smith and Bergeron are both expendable, but not for players without contracts as of July.
And who ever said Bergeron is good on the powerplay is not watching the same hockey as everyone else. He is fast and has a good shot, but every other part of his game is a liability. I would love to see Bergeron gone, and at the same time, take Torres and Horcoff with him. I can't figure out why people in Edmonton thing that Horcoff is so great. He is a third line centre on every other team in the league. We need some help in E-Town. When you are shaking your way through the 3rd period against the lowely LA Kings, you know you are in trouble.
Sturm and Stuart are not the problem solvers. Neither is Brewer. Hope Lowe can do something though. |
|
|
|
lyall
PickupHockey Pro
360 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2007 : 12:09:18
|
| What's wrong with Torres?? |
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2007 : 17:27:02
|
| Torres?? Well, to me, Torres would rather make a hit than make a play. When he plays recklessly his is a huge defensively liability. He can not create offense on his own, and he is a very streaky player. Hence, the 8 goals and 16 assists in 50 games. 40 points in a season for a guy making about a million/year. He doesn't add anything special to the team. What ever skills he has, there are at least 3 other Oilers with the same skills or better. To me, that makes him expendable in a package deal for a real D-man. Someone who can pass and play the point on the powerplay. Something we don't have. (And don't even try to tell me Bergeron can. He can't!) |
|
|
|
lyall
PickupHockey Pro
360 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2007 : 20:19:21
|
| Torres brings an intenseity to the Oilers than no one esle does. He hits hard & plays mean. He may not be the best player on the bench, but he works hard almost every night. When Smyth & Hemsky were out Torres, Stoll & Pisani really stepped up. He sits in 6th spot on the Oilers for points, ahead of highly priced Pisani & Lupul. He's at a +4, which ranks 3rd outa all the Oilers. Doesn't seem like too bad of a player to me. |
Edited by - lyall on 01/28/2007 20:20:04 |
|
|
|
Guest6836
( )
|
Posted - 01/29/2007 : 05:46:58
|
| and a 1 million dollar 40 point defenceman isnt half bad at all |
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2007 : 07:29:04
|
Hey guest6836, do you research. Torres is not a defenseman.
The intensity that Torres brings to the Oilers is no different than Stoll, Staios, Smyth, Reasoner, Moreau (when he is healthy), Thorenson, Winchester, or Peterson. The difference in that the players I mentioned will make a hit to make the play, Torres makes the hit to make the hit. No point to it, no reason, just a defensive mistake most often.
And the fact that he is 6th on the team in scoring means nothing. Being 6th on the 23rd highest score team out of 30 should be nothing to be proud of.
My point is that he could leave the team tomorrow and it would not impact their ability to win. On a personal level, I have disliked him even before he was an Oiler. I don't like his style. Again, he will sacrifice a play for a hit while most good players will make a hit to improve the play.
|
|
|
|
lyall
PickupHockey Pro
360 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2007 : 08:51:39
|
| No, Torres brings a fierce intesnity that no one else realy does. He is really just an all around agressive player. And a scary S.O.B at that. Have you ever looked at his eyes after he gets hit or misses a goal? He looks like he is ready to rip the heads off the entire opposing team. Even his voice is scary. He will make a hit to make a hit, but when he does it takes the player out of the play(sometimes out of the game). He has 2 line mates to gain control of the puck after he makes a big hit, and he often get back into the play afterwards. It's his job to be making those big hits. Personally I think the Oilers would have alot more success if they hit more & played rougher. And you're right being 6th in scoring on the 23rd ranked team is not all that great in NHL standings. But In Oilers standins it isn't too bad. And my point was that he is getting more points than people like Lupul & Pisani, who are gettin paid alot more. And being a plus anyhing on the Oilers is something to be proud of, so plus 4 is even better. |
Edited by - lyall on 01/29/2007 08:52:53 |
|
|
|
Guest6836
( )
|
Posted - 01/29/2007 : 11:37:51
|
| my bad I was confused an thinking you were talkin about bergeron |
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2007 : 13:15:33
|
| You have your opinion, I will have mine. Torres is expendable in any way you look at it. He has never been a player to change the shape of a game. I agree that the Oilers do play better when they skate hard, hit, and forcheck. That still doesn't make Torres a great player. You are right that he is statistically better than Pisani and Lupal. Lupal is under-achieving big time compared to what the Oilers wanted out of him. But don't forget, Pisani gets a lot of his minutes on the Penalty Kill. Raffi does not. Pisani, along with Stoll, Smyth, and Horcoff are the soul of the 2nd best penalty kill in the league. So Pisani may only have 18 points compared to Torres' 24. That's fine with me. I would take Pisani over Torres any day of the week. Why? Because he is a smart two way hockey player. Torres is not great offensively or defensively. Average to good hitters are a dime a dozen in the NHL. What else does Torres bring to the table?? Not much, again, in my opinion. I'm done with this topic. |
|
|
|
devilsjetsfan
Top Prospect
Canada
59 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2007 : 16:15:08
|
trade j smith not m.a. bergeron
Go Devils Go |
|
|
|
KariyaSelanne
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
297 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2007 : 17:06:38
|
I agree if you trade Smith plus another averrage guy you could probably get a pretty good D-man that would help alot.
Go Preds Go!!! |
|
|
|
oil guy
Rookie
Canada
122 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2007 : 12:07:08
|
IMO J Smith is expendable, Torres is but I think he would be a better player to keep due to his skill and price tag. Horcoff should go. To expensive for his skill level, Pisani is the same. M.A.B is a farce and should go just to free up some locker room. Way to unrealiable.
Smyth is a must keep at what ever price he asks. Lupal is having a bad season but i think he is a keeper who will settle in hopefully this season if not for sure next.
Moreau and Staios are also definate keepers.
|
|
|
|
leigh
Moderator
Canada
1755 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2007 : 14:00:58
|
| I have to agree with beans on this. Torres is extremely expendable. You can find a hundred guys to take over his spot. My thought is to use him as trade fauder. He has value right now because he's young and shows signs of having a good future . If you're worried about giving up an asset that may materialize down the road, don't worry, Edmonton has lots of up and commers. Let this one go. Use him (or any other young gun) and get a true goal scorer or a 1st tier d-man. Edmonton has neither right now and that is why they are at the bottom. |
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2007 : 19:08:49
|
I think that Smyth is handling the scoring duties just fine. He is only 6 goals off of Ovechkin and has played 10 less games because of a broken hand!! A little support would be nice, but not top priority.
Did anyone watch the Columbus/Edmonton game last night?? I had the honor of watching the game from a Luxury Box, and I was quite impressed with the overall team when they are missing one of their supposed "stars." With Markkanen in net, the defense played with confidence and moved the puck well. They were not put in bad positions like Roloson puts them in when he plays the puck behind the net. If anyone out there watches the game, counts how many times the Oilers defense is forced to slap the puck around the boards because Roloson stops the puck behind the net with an opposing fore-check coming.
I say that Roloson is tradable. Markkanen is not the #1 guy either. So it's tough. I guess Lowe has to try to find a defenseman that can cover for Roloson’s horrible puck handling habits.
|
|
|
|
Canucks Man
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1547 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2007 : 01:35:28
|
Beans i agree with you last comment about Roloson, He cant handle the pressure this year of being a starter, i thought last year he came in fresh and that was the number one reason he was good towards te end of the season and playoffs, he spent to much time being a backup/half a season goalie to be a starter at his age
CANUCKS RULE!! |
|
|
|
oil guy
Rookie
Canada
122 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2007 : 06:41:39
|
i agree that roli is not a great goalie, he is a good goalie but then if he was not would he even be in the nhl?
jussi is a great backup but that is all.
i think more than a top tier d man the oilers need a bonified #1 goalie and have since fuhr/moog.
|
|
|
|
lyall
PickupHockey Pro
360 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2007 : 10:21:40
|
I agree 100% Beans. Roli needs to get traded. Jussi is a good backup, but has the ability to play alot more then he does. His only major fault is that he is a streak goalie. So with proper coaching he can work out really well for the Oilers. I also was at the CBJ game, & yes, the defance played really well. They still need alot of improvment but good none the less. Last night against VAN, lots of give aways & turnovers.
..............say what you will about Torres, but he's played very well the last 2 games. |
Edited by - lyall on 02/02/2007 10:21:56 |
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2007 : 11:41:40
|
Hey Lyall, who was the Oiler to give up the puck at the Van blue line to Naslund??? It was Torres. Then, who fell down to give Naslund a free shot a Roloson. It was Bergeron. Then, with the Oilers looking like they might claw back in, with the goalie pulled, who took an ill-advised shot giving a big rebound the Van took down the ice to score on the open net??? Bergeron. In the last two minutes Bergeron and Torres combined to give the game away.
Torres did play good against Columbus and half of the Vancouver game, but that is expected. He is a streaky player. He will have 3-4 good games and then disappears for a 10 games stretch. I don't think he is a horrible player (like Bergeron) but there are literally 100+ players in the league in of his caliber, and another 150+ that are better. He is an average player at best.
|
|
|
|
Guest8888
( )
|
Posted - 02/02/2007 : 17:03:07
|
| I would just like to say that Hemsky is completely untradable |
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2007 : 19:39:18
|
| I would never say a player is untradable. I would give up Hemsky if the price was right. It would have to be a Malkin/Kopitar type of player. Good God, The Great One was traded (more than once), Orr was traded, and Howe was traded. A lot of the greatest players ever were traded. Hemsky is definitely tradable, if the price is right. |
|
|
|
-oil-country-
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
988 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2007 : 21:28:56
|
Beans you said it like i definetely don't want to trade Hemsky cause he's one of my favorite players but hey someone offers us Frolov,Kopitar,Malkin or something good then i'm happy
(not saying that LA or Pittsburgh will offer us that but you never know maybe the GM who traded Thornton will get hired again lol  , glad i'm not a Boston fan i would have been so pissed.) |
Edited by - -oil-country- on 02/02/2007 21:30:27 |
|
|
|
Guest2981
( )
|
Posted - 02/03/2007 : 17:40:59
|
horcoff is a bum .. pisani is a bum
why would u want to trade torres or jason smith or ma bergeron
torres is a great younge rplayer ..
he'll get his 20 goals and he can change the momentum of the game
like last year against SJ in the playoffs when he scored that goal
changed the whole playoffs for the oilers
jason smith is the heart and soul of this team you cant trade your captain ...
and marc andre bergeron is a younger up and commer who is the oilers PP
he has a rocket shot and is speedy .. he may be a retard but hes still young
and guys like thoreson and winchester are total bums how are they even in the NHL
and matt grenne should not be in the nhl hes the worst player ive ever seen in my life hes big dumb and terrible all aroundthey should just put him on waivers |
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2007 : 10:22:12
|
| I can see that you have no hockey sense at all me Guest2981 so I won't even waste my time explaining anything to you. My justification is that anyone who claims that Jason Smith is the heart and soul of the Oilers rather than Ryan Smyth doesn't actually know a thing about the Oilers! |
|
|
|
Canucks Man
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1547 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2007 : 11:32:50
|
Thers no way jason smith is the heart and soul of the oilers, thats ryan smyth hands down. and raffi torres wont score 20 goals this year he is way to streaky he will score in 2 games or so in a row, then go 10 or so games wth out one, and right now hes on a goaless drought.
100 POST TO ME!!
CANUCKS RULE!! |
|
|
|
-oil-country-
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
988 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2007 : 13:39:21
|
| I know Torres is a streaky player but he isnt on a goal drought he scored 2 games ago. |
|
|
|
lyall
PickupHockey Pro
360 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2007 : 23:53:03
|
quote:
Originally posted by Guest2981
horcoff is a bum .. pisani is a bum
why would u want to trade torres or jason smith or ma bergeron
torres is a great younge rplayer ..
he'll get his 20 goals and he can change the momentum of the game
like last year against SJ in the playoffs when he scored that goal
changed the whole playoffs for the oilers
jason smith is the heart and soul of this team you cant trade your captain ...
and marc andre bergeron is a younger up and commer who is the oilers PP
he has a rocket shot and is speedy .. he may be a retard but hes still young
and guys like thoreson and winchester are total bums how are they even in the NHL
and matt grenne should not be in the nhl hes the worst player ive ever seen in my life hes big dumb and terrible all aroundthey should just put him on waivers
I don't like when people who know nothing about the Oilers think what they say has any vaule. I'm with Beans. I'm not gunna wast my time explaining how many things are wrong with what you said.
And Beans, I was just giving you a hard time Cause Torres go those 2 goals againts CBJ...........And does anyone else here realize that Smyth has gotten 9 pionts in his last 5 games? And Hemsky & Horcoff are chashing in also. Put the old line back together and good things happen. But what happened to Sykora?
|
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2007 : 10:15:35
|
I think Sykora went in the dog house with MacT so he’s not getting the minutes any more. He has never been a player that created his own chances, so he needs a Hemsky type player with his. He is last year's Samsonov. He is expected to have a point a game, but he needs a player to set him up and MacT doesn’t give the ice or the linemates make that happen. I think he may be gone at the deadline.
And don't kid yourself Lyall, Hemsky and Horcoff (especially Horcoff) are benefiting from Smyth having a career season. Hemsky has stepped up at bit in the past few games, but Horcoff?? He is just a coat-tail rider. Can you imagine that line with a legitimate first line centre??
|
|
|
|
lyall
PickupHockey Pro
360 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2007 : 12:53:43
|
| Yeah I agree with that. But Smyth actually request to play alongside Horcoff. Since the line got back together they all have been racking up pionts. So even if he is riding the coat-tails, it's benaficial for the Oilers. |
|
|
|
Canucks Man
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1547 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2007 : 23:11:34
|
Who cares if a player is rideing coattails as long as he his producing.
CANUCKS RULE!! |
|
|
|
Guest4132
( )
|
Posted - 02/06/2007 : 00:05:07
|
| Why pick someone up if you're not going to play him.. Oilers picked up Nedved & now they have sat him down for 3 or 4 games.. Maybe they should trade him also.. |
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2007 : 08:04:17
|
| Trade him to who??? For what?? They picked him up on waivers. Do you know what that means? That means that his team didn't want him anymore so they gave him up for nothing! Nedved is worthless (not personally) right now and no one would take him in a trade. It was a risk that Lowe took, thinking that Hemsky, Sykora, and Nedved would fly. He was wrong. |
|
|
|
lyall
PickupHockey Pro
360 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2007 : 10:24:10
|
| Good risk to take though. They didn't lose anything. And Neved has gotten pionts in 3 or 4 games for the Oilers too. |
Edited by - lyall on 02/06/2007 10:24:53 |
|
|
|
Guest1403
( )
|
Posted - 02/12/2007 : 17:38:05
|
lets face it the oilers are junk and have no chance at making the playoffs and cant stand up to powerhouses like calgary who keep improving through trades and its looking more and more like ryan smyth wont resign so how about a trade and sign type deal:
If oilers drop out and dont sign smyth at the deadline
Jason smith
Ryan smyth (signed to MTL
to Montreal
FOR
Michael Ryder
sheldon souray (signed to EDM) |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
Boston-Edmonton Rumor 
