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bablaboushka
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2417 Posts |
 Posted - 03/03/2007 : 21:22:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest0807
The nucks got a top 6 forward...
I'll pretend I didn't read that. |
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guinman
Top Prospect
Canada
52 Posts |
Posted - 03/03/2007 : 22:08:14
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quote:
Originally posted by bablaboushka
Pittsburgh? Give me a break.
Laraque and Roberts are far from franchise-changing players. They will both be there to protect Crosby and friends. Roberts will add a few points but Laraque won't. Other than that how are they better contenders? They have no defense and an inconsistent goalie. High scoring will do them fine in the regular season but come playoff time they'll need the defense and they just don't have it. Roberts and Laraque did nothing to help that.
The slagging of the Pittsburgh D is getting old and cliche. This was the EXACT same crap that observers claimed before 1991, Even after Samuelsson was acquired. I would respectfully submit that the pens blue line core is quite proficient although very young and prone to making mistakes, these guys have made huge strides in only 2 seasons. They actually are quite underated. I can think of a lot of older D-cores that are prone to mistakes too. with no youthfull upside. What's better, young and improving or older, not so great and no up-side? You should all be aware that Mark Eaton who is again injured was out of the line-up for over 2 months. Eaton does a lot for a team. He's a great on the PK and consistently is a top 5 shot blocker in the league. He can skate and make a good first pass. The mostly young/inexperienced D -core performed admirably in his absence though shaky at first. Eaton came back in the middle of the big winning streak not coincidentally that following couple of weeks Fleury posted 3 Shut outs. Gonchar is a little less consistent without his partner Eaton. Alan Nassredine although not young is a journeyman minor leaguer until this year. He's 2nd or 3rd on the team in +/- at about plus 10. He's very steady and has decent mobility. Kinda reminds me of a guy named Gordie Roberts. Overall the pens D has great mobility, good puck movement with two great pp weapons. More experience will only help them but I will still maintain that they are more proficient in there own zone than they get credit for.
I can think of quite a few D cores around the league who are young an prone to mistakes who aren't sitting in a play-off spot. This is where I question your take on Fleury's 'inconsistency'. Ya I guess if about 6 below par games in 50 or so is inconsistent than you've got a case. Otherwise I'd say you're not paying attention. Exactly what qualifies as consistant? I guess you could point to stats but I'd submit that Fuhr was inconsistent based on that logic. Brodeur is consistant. Luongo is consistent. A few other guys are close to them but are they 'consistent' enough for you'? Right now Fleury is one of the best goalies in the league. Look at the Carolina pens game on friday. The pens played a back to backer in Carolina and out played the canes. They limited them to about 26 shots and defended very well without Eaton. Ward had a great game and Thibault absolutely wreaked. Based on the workload Fluery could of easily had a S.O.. Sure Fleury is still very young and could faulter in the play-offs as could any young player. Or he could pull a Cam Ward. Is Turco consistent? Here's a great regular season goalie who posts the awesome stats every year. Then in the playoffs his somewhat flawed technique is only overshadowed by his mental lapses. Do you like Turco's chances? Calling Fleury as of now inconsistent is nothing more than a vague cliche. About 80% of NHL starting goalies could easily be labeled 'inconsistent'. It depends what standard you want to hold them too. I know what poor play looks like. To me inconsistent is playing poorly too often. There's no way Fleury fits in that category right now. I'd say Fleury's had a great year and I like his huge upside. He's just a kid and it's no coincidence that since bringing in a good goalie coach in Meloche that he's improving every day.
Honestly right know I can't think of many goalies I'd rather have than MAF.
As for Laraque and Roberts - they are what they are. I would wholeheartedly submit that playoff success will rest hugely on MAF's shoulders as it will for every other playoff contender. Arrogantly counting them out based on baseless if not vague assertions is foolhardy. I can only hope the penguins opponents feel the same as you. I guarantee you they don't. |
Edited by - guinman on 03/03/2007 22:28:23 |
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tctitans
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
931 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2007 : 02:24:16
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quote:
Originally posted by leigh
Yup, Calgary. They don't get enough credit. They have more depth than people think. I guess if you don't watch them much you wouldn't know that. Problem lately is that Kipper has been soft. If he regains his form then I think they are true contenders. They're back at the top of their div again (tied w/ Van). I'm liking their chances.
Homer. ;) |
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tctitans
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
931 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2007 : 02:26:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest4174
The only reason why the canucks are making the playoffs is this guy named Luongo....ring a bell????
1. He sure helps, but not the only reason
2. He's a part of the team... so it really doesnt matter if it's only him anyways.
dont forget Saborin should have had 2 pts in Buffalo (got 1), and he got the win in Anaheim too. |
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tctitans
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
931 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2007 : 02:32:32
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quote:
Originally posted by bablaboushka
quote:
Originally posted by Guest0807
The nucks got a top 6 forward...
I'll pretend I didn't read that.
I don't want to over-inflate the Nux moves, but I do want to point out that Smolinski was Chicago's #1 center and 2nd on their team in scoring (not to mention a +10). Yes, this was Chicago, but it still at least doesnt warrant your implication. ;) |
Edited by - tctitans on 03/04/2007 02:35:42 |
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Guest4560
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Posted - 03/04/2007 : 03:41:53
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| Smolinski is over-rated by Vancouver fans. He is barely a top six forward, and on Ottawa he was their 3rd line centre. Smokes is a good 3rd line depth centre, he is not going to do much other than add another two-way player to an already decent shut-down Canuck team. Nonis should have addressed the lack of offense. Smolinski will not produce goals in that system. |
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tctitans
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
931 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2007 : 04:00:54
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest4560
Smolinski is over-rated by Vancouver fans. He is barely a top six forward, and on Ottawa he was their 3rd line centre. Smokes is a good 3rd line depth centre, he is not going to do much other than add another two-way player to an already decent shut-down Canuck team. Nonis should have addressed the lack of offense. Smolinski will not produce goals in that system.
I basically agree with you. Smolinksi is entirely for depth and isnt expected to score. My point to babs was that it's not entirely out of the realm of possibility that he's a top 6 forward. Hell, he's not even a top 6 on the Canucks, but my point was that it's not as obvious as the implication.
Nonis couldnt get scoring help. He'd have to give up high draft picks or young talent, just for rental players. Not wise for 'most' teams. |
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Guest2753
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Posted - 03/04/2007 : 13:14:56
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| well I bet todays game shut alot of people up (Including me) about Roberts. |
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bablaboushka
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2417 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2007 : 16:20:40
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| Not me, it's one game... against Philly. It was like people getting excited about Conroy racking up points against LA in his first game with the Flames. |
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bablaboushka
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2417 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2007 : 16:33:22
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Ok guinman, here's my initial take to your response:
BS. The way you go on talking about the Pittsburgh D just goes to show that you can't offer any concrete evidence to support your case that they are a solid, reliable D. "They have great mobility, good puck movement...etc.", give me a break. If they didn't have mobility or puck control skills they wouldn't be in the NHL. In fact, on most teams half of them wouldn't anyways. I can think of a younger D group, the Sharks D, who are much more reliable and can indeed out-play the Penguins D any day. Although they do make the odd mistake of inexperience, Rivet has arrived and will help them with their patience. Pittsburgh doesn't have a Rivet or a Hannan, their leader is an offense-first D man (Gonchar). Like Souray, Ryan Whitney can produce on the PP but he is a huge liability in his own end. Point being that at the deadline, Pittsburgh needed a Rivet and they didn't get one. They were too worried about protecting Crosby.
Fleury is so incredibly inconsistent. His record has nothing to do with his consistency (or his lack thereof), it's just the result of it. He can easily let in 5 goals one game, have a shutout the next, then allow another 5 goals after that. While this is technically possible for any goalie, Fleury has perfected the art. Great, potential Cup-winning goalies are consistent for long stretches. Brodeur allows more than 4 goals maybe twice every 10 games (if that) and probably the same with Luongo. Their team can count on them 8 or 9 games out of 10 to give them a reasonable chance to win. To be safe, Pittsburgh would have to score 6 every game, just in case.
They just didn't get the job done at the deadline, simple as that. |
Edited by - bablaboushka on 03/04/2007 16:35:28 |
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Guest4734
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Posted - 03/04/2007 : 18:34:27
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quote:
Originally posted by bablaboushka
Pittsburgh? Give me a break.
Laraque and Roberts are far from franchise-changing players. They will both be there to protect Crosby and friends. Roberts will add a few points but Laraque won't. Other than that how are they better contenders? They have no defense and an inconsistent goalie. High scoring will do them fine in the regular season but come playoff time they'll need the defense and they just don't have it. Roberts and Laraque did nothing to help that.
Sorry man, but inconsistent goltender might be trube, but the sharks have had inconsistent goaltenders, montreal too, the leafs, canucks(shaky start by luongo, playing amazing now), too many teams have had inconsistent goaltenders, but as too who has made the best moves, i really don't know |
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bablaboushka
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2417 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2007 : 18:56:43
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| So are you agreeing with me or not? I never said that those other teams didn't, in fact San Jose has been like that lately because Nabokov is a tool and I'll be the first to admit it. But Pittsburgh certainly does too. |
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leigh
Moderator
Canada
1755 Posts |
Posted - 03/04/2007 : 19:37:05
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quote:
Originally posted by bablaboushka
Not me, it's one game... against Philly. It was like people getting excited about Conroy racking up points against LA in his first game with the Flames.
You gotta let this go Babs, how long do we have to go until you are proven wrong buddy. He has 11 points in 15 games. That's pretty darn good. Flames are in the running for 1st in the NW...and are one point back of your Sharks with a game in hand. Conroy was a great addition albeit not at the deadline. |
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