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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4607 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2011 :  06:04:58  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
With the upcoming draft and free agents about to be let loose, what next big move do you think Burke will make?

It is clear that once again, the Leafs need a top line centre, and after a bit of a resurgent year for many of the forwards, there are actually pieces to play with. In addition, Burke has two low first round picks to potentially trade up for a higher pick, or use in a trade for an established player.

This year, I think the pressure will be even greater to make the playoffs as Leafs management tries to build a winner in a hockey-mad market.

Give us your musings/wishes on what you think Burke should do, or what he might do!

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug

Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
2283 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2011 :  06:42:17  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think you are right About this year the pressure being on,

Goaltending is there Reimer has shown he can start as long as Burke picks up a solid backup that can carry the load should Reimer stumble, and there is no reason burke can`t do this with options in Turco Garon Giguere, the net should not be a problem

Defence is solid and deffinetly good enough to win with Phaneuf looking like his old self at the end of the season Komisarek plaing better Aulie and Gunnerson stepping up Schenn having a solid year last year, if i were Burke i would try and add some depth on the blueline but again there is a wealth of players available to fill a depth role again should not be a problem

with the backend pretty well taken care of you are right there is pressure on Burke seeing as though he has the tools to work with to improve the teams only real short coming on paper and thats down the middle

I think almost as important if not more than the hole at the number 1 center hole is the bottom 6, personnally i really do not like the Leafs bottom six, they are young anf have potential but maybe adding a big vetran checking forward could help, Raffi Torres or maybe JAson Chimera could be a good fit,, Obviously Burke will be looking to add Richards but he does have the tools to maybe go get a Jeff Carter who may be available to clear capspace,, tools he hasn`t had since he gave them up for Kessel,


oh and if Burke really wants im sure the habs are willing to part with Gomez

"I led the league in "Go get 'em next time." - Bob Uecker
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8190 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2011 :  08:08:15  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think the Leafs will miss Kaberle's talent on the PP unless they find someone to fill that hole. Granted he was below average in the playoffs but if Phaneuf doesn't play well or gets hurt, the Leaf's PP is extremely weak on the back end. Considering the Leafs PP has been feable at best, I see that as a hole.

The obvious is also down the middle. A group consisting of Bozak, Kadri, Grabovski, and Brent is 3 quality players short in the opinion of most. Kadri might break out and there is an outside shot at Colbourne making the squad, but there is still a pretty big gap there.

Finally, and I don't want to deflate any hopes, but Reimer is still very young and unproven. If he tanks, the Leafs are in trouble. The are still not a solid enough team top to bottom to succeed without high quality goaltending.

I see the Leafs better than last year. I see them as a playoff team. However, I also see them just a few misses away from a lottery team again. One can not expect all the players who had career seasons last year to repeat or do better.

Burke's Needs are(in this order):

#1 Centre
Offensive Defensemen
Back Up Goalie
Depth at Centre
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4607 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2011 :  08:23:39  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I agree somewhat, Pasty.

The bottom 6 definitely needs a few different pieces, although I do like a few of the guys slated to be there.

I think Bozak moves down to be our third line centre (no matter what), as he has shown good promise as a defensive forward, good on faceoffs, and he can score or set-up a goal once in a while.

I like Boyce as a 3rd/4th line centre, he has great energy and potential as a youngster, and he has shown a bit of touch around the net for short periods of time. I also really like Brent, awesome energy player with nice defensive posture for a young forward.

I think Armstrong is a keeper, and the Leafs do play better when he is in the lineup.

So, additions to the bottom 6 might be one or two bigger, tougher bodies in there . . . but as far as skill, tenacity and some decent defensive play, our bottom 6 looks ok, IMHO.

The big question is how does Burke get a real first line centre; where in the line-up does Kadri fit in (if he makes the club finally!); who is potentially leaving to get that first line centre; who is backing up Reimer.

I say Burke tries his best to swing a deal to get Jeff Carter, using one of the first round picks and possibly that 2nd rounder because of Boston making the finals, plus a good young prospect (maybe even Kadri, although I doubt it). Remember, Philly wouldn't be able to take on very much salary, so they'd be looking for picks/prospects on the way back. Maybe this year's 30th pick, 2nd rounder 2012, and say Scrivens or Rynnas (goalies).

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4607 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2011 :  08:30:39  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Beans - your point about needing an offensive defenceman:

Not so sure about that, actually. Phaneuf improved remarkably after the departure of Kaberle, and Gunnarson has shown flashes of being that offensive, puck moving defenceman. I think with Phaneuf playing like he did in the second half, and Gunnarson's stats taking a jump with more ice time, this area might work out.

Tough to say though, and I could end up agreeing that it's a need by mid-season.

No matter what though, even with no first line centre joining the team, if Reimer plays anything close to last year, this is a competetive team that should be able to make the playoffs.

Although, since it's been soooo long . . . it still seems like some distant dream to have playoff hockey in this town. Don't let me down Burkie!

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Guest2712
( )

Posted - 06/20/2011 :  08:55:02  Reply with Quote
Kadri may fit well as a winger on the 2nd line, in which case you can say bye-bye to MacArthur.

some good reports about Jake Gardner during his stint in the AHL last year, so he may push for a spot, and may be a good replacement for Kaberle on the PP. but knowing Burke's philosophy he'll keep him in the minors to start the season.

top line centre is the biggest void to fill. if not Richards, or Carter, then what? he'll have to explore trade options, in which case i can see him dangling guys like Lupul or maybe even Gustavsson. though not sure how much he'll fetch in return. Grabovski may be able to fetch some good return in a trade, but then Burke would be looking for a 2nd line center to replace him. Laich is a UFA, but he could be signed already by the time this all goes down. could slot Kadri in as a 2nd line center? maybe even take a chance on Joe Colbourne?
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The Duke
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1041 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2011 :  19:15:15  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I like Gunnarson Slozo...but i don`t think he will ever be what the leafs need as a PP setup man. Beans is absolutely right, the leafs are in desperate need of a true bonafied offensive defenseman. There are a couple of possibilities in their system, but they are not there yet.

The leafs need someone right now ( D - man ) who has maybe 2 years left on their contract. This time frame will give them more time to look at what they have in their system.

Bring a true 1st line centerman into the mix right now and their already centerman will look that much better being knocked down the ladder a step or two. They have 2 - 3 good centerman but they are just not first line material.

If the leafs address these two pressing needs, next season they will have a true playoff contending team capable of making some playoff noise...along with pending stellar play from Reimer.

Don`t be surprised if a guy like Joe Thornton joins the leafs dressing room on draft day. In my opinion, these draft picks Burke has aquired will be used to lure an NHL ready player with great upside.

If Brad Richards was interested in playing with Toronto, Burke would already have his neg. rights...you can bank on it. Since they don`t...count on Richards not being a leaf..this is my opinion anyway, maybe i`m wrong.

There isn`t 1 player available as a UFA of Richards talents. If the leafs aren`t getting him...look for a big trade. Then again, after that nasty concussion word...maybe someone would be smart to steer away from Richards.
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
2283 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2011 :  19:31:19  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
if Richards wants 7 mil per season for more than 5 years i think the buds should stay away, cap space is ever so valuable ,, take it from a habs fan you don`t want a 7 milion $ player not performing espcially in a hoceky market!!!!

"I led the league in "Go get 'em next time." - Bob Uecker
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8190 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2011 :  21:28:32  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I can't wait for the Brad Richards signing. That will quite the Leaf Nation. I will eat my shorts if he plays for TO. He's already stated publically that he is not interested in the Leafs. Second, the team in the NHL with the 2nd most amount of cap space(Carolina) is on his list of team and Ruthford knows and appreciates the value of being deep down the middle. Not only that, but NYR is also dumping everything possible to land him.
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3598 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2011 :  21:33:19  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:

Don`t be surprised if a guy like Joe Thornton joins the leafs dressing room on draft day.



I would be absolutely stunned if Joe Thornton is a Leaf on draft day. Why on earth would Thornton waive his NMC to go from perennial contender SJ to the Leafs?
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Porkchop73
PickupHockey Pro



640 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  04:02:47  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Burke already made his next move. He fired two assistant coaches, Acton and Hunter. Replacing them with Scott Gordon and Greg Cronin.
I would say Burke is assembling a team like the US olympic team. He now has two of the coaches from that team. Or Wilson is on his way out and Burke has gotten Gordon to jump up immediately when Wilson does get let go.

As for player movement.. I don't think the Leafs will get Richards. Look for some other more bold move then that. Its just Burkes style to go big or go home.
And then look for Grabo, a top prospect, and one the first round picks to be moved. Thats what my gut tells me anyways. I am thinking maybe Jeff Carter out of Philly. Philly could take on Grabo under the salary cap most likely no matter what Bryzgalov signs for.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4607 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  05:09:48  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Duke - I've disagreed with you many times before, but your logic is hard to argue with when discussing the Brad Richards possibility. You're right . . . there isn't a more meddlesome / proactive GM out there, Burke WOULD have gotten the negotiating rights, that would make sense for such a coveted free agent (it's why Philly did it with Bryzgalov).

I also agree that Richards to Toronto is unlikely. But giving the reason that he has publicly stated that he doesn't want to go to Toronto . . . well, that's not much of a reason, IMHO. Players say a lot of things that turn out to be the exact opposite of the truth, lol. Especially concerning Toronto, where you want to deflect as much specualtion as possible before a big deal might go down.

But like I said, I don't think it's likely either now, the more I think about it. Burke won't want to overpay for Richards, who isn't that old, but is certainly not young anymore either. Richards had concussion issues, to boot.

And Beans . . ."I can't wait for the Brad Richards signing. That will quite the Leaf Nation."

First off, there are more Leafers on this site saying it probably won't happen as opposed to those saying it will. So again, the false indignation against "those crazy Leaf fans" is just that - a made up outrage that masks a burning hatred.

Probably just jealous.

Porkchop - I think Burke will definitely pursue Carter, yes; but give up Grabo, no. Again, Philly needs cheap assets going back, which sort of handicaps them a bit, and it'll be picks and prospects, maybe a rookie/second year player. And it won't be that expensive for a legitimate first line center, most importantly.


"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
2283 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  05:39:17  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by slozo

Duke - I've disagreed with you many times before, but your logic is hard to argue with when discussing the Brad Richards possibility. You're right . . . there isn't a more meddlesome / proactive GM out there, Burke WOULD have gotten the negotiating rights, that would make sense for such a coveted free agent (it's why Philly did it with Bryzgalov).

I also agree that Richards to Toronto is unlikely. But giving the reason that he has publicly stated that he doesn't want to go to Toronto . . . well, that's not much of a reason, IMHO. Players say a lot of things that turn out to be the exact opposite of the truth, lol. Especially concerning Toronto, where you want to deflect as much specualtion as possible before a big deal might go down.

But like I said, I don't think it's likely either now, the more I think about it. Burke won't want to overpay for Richards, who isn't that old, but is certainly not young anymore either. Richards had concussion issues, to boot.

And Beans . . ."I can't wait for the Brad Richards signing. That will quite the Leaf Nation."

First off, there are more Leafers on this site saying it probably won't happen as opposed to those saying it will. So again, the false indignation against "those crazy Leaf fans" is just that - a made up outrage that masks a burning hatred.

Probably just jealous.

Porkchop - I think Burke will definitely pursue Carter, yes; but give up Grabo, no. Again, Philly needs cheap assets going back, which sort of handicaps them a bit, and it'll be picks and prospects, maybe a rookie/second year player. And it won't be that expensive for a legitimate first line center, most importantly.


"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug



would the leafs be willing to give up both their first round picks they aquired last season and a good prospect like Colborne for Carter, obviously carter is still young and with a very reasonable cap hit, but i would take a package like that at least for philly to part ways with him,, even more now that i think of it

"I led the league in "Go get 'em next time." - Bob Uecker
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4607 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  06:32:55  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
No, I really don't see Burke giving up both first rounders, unless it's to trade up for a higher pick perhaps.

I don't think the price for Carter will be that high . . . Philly is in serious cap trouble, and the other teams aren't under pressure to help them.

My best guess right now is, the asking price for Carter might be a low first rounder, a second rounder, and a decent prospect, or workable 1st/2nd year player that can get into the lineup. Perhaps even less, if the prospect is more highly touted (like Colborne is).

If I am Leafs GM, I might offer (for Jeff Carter):
1) Boston's first rounder, 2012 2nd rounder, and Boyce.
2) Boston's 1st rounder, and Joe Colbourne.

Something in that range.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Guest4312
( )

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  07:33:26  Reply with Quote
i hope the leafs trade one of the first rounders (25 or 30th overall) and the second rounder 39th overall and move up into the 10-15 range and get mark scheifele or possibly someone else drops like strome, zibanejad, or even couturier..... a team they may target are the avalanche that have two picks in that range
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8190 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  08:39:25  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Slozo, this is not the only hockey forum site(although it is the best ) and there is an insane number of Leafs fans who comment on Richards as if it's a done deal. I know of one who was going to get a jersey made already!!

I think Carter is also a more realistic option and the deal you suggested ( Colbourne and a 1st rounder)would be close. would be about right in He also has a very palatable contract at $5.2 million cap hit, but it is an 11 yr deal. I'm still not sold on the uber-long term deal. However, if the Leafs (or any team for that matter) can lock down a legitimate 1st line centre for that kind of money than it frees up cash for other areas. Such as a PP quarterback.

Richards will command $6-$7 million, maybe more considering the cap just went up and he is the top draw of this years class. I would be far happier as a Leaf fan to find another alternative to Richards based on contract value alone.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4607 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  09:05:38  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Ok Beans . . . but I really think you're taking the fact that you now wear a Leafs avatar a bit too seriously . . . no need to hang out at the Leafs sites, dude.

Although, I've gotta say, at a place like Pension Plan Puppets - one of the best "Leafs" chat sites . . . they are very well informed, and most say that Richards is not coming here. On the "smart" sites, most commenters are pretty realistic and logical, actually.

Just like here, I'd like to think.



"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5810 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  09:53:03  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
There are other sites?
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Guest2712
( )

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  10:06:14  Reply with Quote
a 1st rounder and Joe Colbourne for Carter? hmmm, not sure i'd make that deal. don't know if anyone else feels this way, but i'm not completely sold on Carter yet. stats wise he's only had one solid year. aside from that he's never got more then 70 pts in a season. is that really top line center material? i'm not sure i'd be willing to part wth Colbourne for him. too high a price, ESPECIALLY with the term on Carter's contract. way too long for a guy who's yet to consistently prove himself.
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8190 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  11:48:48  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
And Colbourne has done what, exactly, to make him so valuable??

Carter has done 60+ points and 30+ goals playing on the 2nd line in Philly! Those are the numbers that Phil Kessel puts up on the 1st line. I think Carter is absolutely the real deal and I would give up 2-1st round draft picks for him.

Without much thought either.
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3598 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  12:40:26  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:

don't know if anyone else feels this way, but i'm not completely sold on Carter yet. stats wise he's only had one solid year. aside from that he's never got more then 70 pts in a season. is that really top line center material?



yeah, I'd give up both first rounders for Carter as well. He's had one excellent (46g/84pt) season and 2 pretty decent (30+g/60+pt) seasons to follow - as Beans says, he doesn't play on the top line in PHI either. Not bad for a second-line forward.

Those are pretty good numbers, I'd give up my 2 late-round draft picks for Carter as well. IMO a Carter-like player is exactly what TOR should be looking to get.
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8190 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  13:33:13  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan

quote:

don't know if anyone else feels this way, but i'm not completely sold on Carter yet. stats wise he's only had one solid year. aside from that he's never got more then 70 pts in a season. is that really top line center material?



yeah, I'd give up both first rounders for Carter as well. He's had one excellent (46g/84pt) season and 2 pretty decent (30+g/60+pt) seasons to follow - as Beans says, he doesn't play on the top line in PHI either. Not bad for a second-line forward.

Those are pretty good numbers, I'd give up my 2 late-round draft picks for Carter as well. IMO a Carter-like player is exactly what TOR should be looking to get.



I agree complete. Not only for his offensive production, but he is also a very responsible defensive player and plays the PK well. He's young at 26 and has the best years of his career in front of him. A line including Kessel and Carter would give most teams fits and I don't think anyone would complain about having 2-30 goal guys on a big line.

For all the Burkie's out there, he plays the kind of game Burke loves to see.

Even if Colborne was to turn out to be as good as Carter, it will be another 3-4 years until he is there. Kessel is a UFA in 3 years. Why wait.

If Carter is available and can be had for a reasonable deal, it's really a no-brainer.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4607 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  14:00:48  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I might give give up both late first rounders that Toronto has for Carter as well, but I don't think they would need to.

I agree with what you guys have said, and would add that he is an excellent pk'er, is hard-nosed as a skilled forward, and has his best years still ahead perhaps.

Only problem is prying him away from Clarke, who is notoriously difficult to deal with in terms of trades. Hopefully it goes like the Gagne deal . . . when his back is against the wall, he lets him go for cheap!

And of course, always the threat that Philly deals him out west where they don't have to face him every so often.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8190 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  14:13:09  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Is Clarke still in Philly?? I thought Holmgren was their GM??

Good point about shipping him out West but I do agree that Philly has a bit of a gun to their head. If they do want to sign Bryzgalov, they have to move a $5ish million a year salary. That Carter is the most attractive player in that range. Briere is a high price, Timonen has one year left on his deal making him less value in a trade, Richards will be Mr. Philly for the next decade and Pronger is not going anywhere until he shows he is recovered from surgery.

Carter as a Leaf is not unlikely. Hey, wait a minute!! What about Carter as an Oilers???? The #19 and a solid young prospect (Lander??) might make that move possible. That would be suuuuu-weeet!!!

Edited by - Beans15 on 06/21/2011 14:14:12
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3598 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  15:19:23  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:

Only problem is prying him away from Clarke, who is notoriously difficult to deal with in terms of trades. Hopefully it goes like the Gagne deal . . . when his back is against the wall, he lets him go for cheap!



I don't think thats going to be the case - PHI was handcuffed with Gagne because he had a NTC and would only OK a trade to TB. Carter does not have a NTC in his deal right now (starting next summer he had a full NMC for 3 years, followed by a limited NMC for the remainder of the deal), so he can be dealt anywhere. I also think there is a great deal more demand for a young 2-way power centre not yet in his prime than an injury-prone scoring winger.

As beans says, Carter is the easiest one for them to move, and also arguably the most coveted asset they have (I don't think they'll contemplate moving Richards). Many teams want that sort of player, not just TOR, and will be willing to trade for it.

Last week there was a rumoured trade brewing between CBJ and PHI - Carter for Voracek and CBJ's first round pick this season. PHI apparently turned it down, so you have an idea of what it would take to pry him away.

Edited by - nuxfan on 06/21/2011 15:20:45
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Guest5052
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Posted - 06/21/2011 :  15:54:30  Reply with Quote
I think highly of Carter and although Philly needs to make a move for cap reasons and Carter is a likely expendable candiate, there are lots of teams that would be interested in his services for all the reasons mentioned above.

I am not convinced that he is exactly what Toronto should be looking for. He is more of a shooting center/winger and I think they might need more of a play making number 1 pivot, especially if the idea is to play him with Kessel. Thats just my sense.
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3598 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  16:02:10  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
AFAIK, Carter's natural position is centre, and he has had to adapt to the RW position as PHI's top-2 centre positions are taken by Briere and Richards (putting him on the 3rd line is a waste). Correct me if I'm wrong.

If that is the case, then perhaps a move back to centre would be good for Carter, and whatever team gets him. He certainly has the playmaking skills of a centre, and the defensive mindset as well.
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8190 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  16:44:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I don't think that Kessel needs a playmaking type of player to succeed. I didn't watch a ton of him with Savard, however Kessel is more of a make his own play kind of guy. Most of his goals seem to be more off the rush, streaking in, coming out from the corner, etc. He is not a typical Heatley/Hull type of sniper that finds open space and buries passes.

If that is the case, I would say a Carter type is a perfect compliment. Those kinds of players feed off each other as having 2 threats on the ice at any time creates more space for the other guy.

Maybe I am off on this, but that's what I see.
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
2283 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  17:07:21  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
see the reason i think Carter will go for more than both first rounders and Colborne is because A. his a legit number one center who can play in all 3 zones B. he is a dominant physical prescence on the ice at 6ft 4 200+ lbs c. how many guys like i just listed are available at a 5.25 cap hit?

the leafs will not be the only team makeing offers for him... The Blue jackets have to start winning to save there franchise ,, The oilers could use a big vetran center who even though is a vet could play with Taylor for 11 more years, hell with the cap going up the habs could fit him in and drop Gomez to a 3rd liner

"I led the league in "Go get 'em next time." - Bob Uecker
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The Duke
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1041 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  19:02:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I would trade those 2 late first rounders in a heart beat for Jeff Carter....Joe Colbourne i would like to hang on to and see what he will bring. The leafs have to start hanging on to these ( blue chip prospects ) type of young players and build around these guys.

Thank God those asst. coaches are gone...YAHOOOOO...at least they are trying something diffrent, it may not work...but at least they are trying. Now, if only Ken Hitchcock can replace that MORON Wilson, all will be happy in leaf land.

Personally i will be very, very surprised if Philly moves Carter, so young and such a dominant player...really can`t see him going anywhere. It will take a damn good young player to fetch Carter, certainly a player no team will want to part with.

Look for San Jose to make a major move this off season...another season gone by...another season with the same results. Joe Thornton is on my wish list for the leafs ...realistically the Sharks will try and move Marleau and Heatley...i think both may be gone if there are any takers.
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
2283 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  20:18:11  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by The Duke

I would trade those 2 late first rounders in a heart beat for Jeff Carter....Joe Colbourne i would like to hang on to and see what he will bring. The leafs have to start hanging on to these ( blue chip prospects ) type of young players and build around these guys.

Thank God those asst. coaches are gone...YAHOOOOO...at least they are trying something diffrent, it may not work...but at least they are trying. Now, if only Ken Hitchcock can replace that MORON Wilson, all will be happy in leaf land.

Personally i will be very, very surprised if Philly moves Carter, so young and such a dominant player...really can`t see him going anywhere. It will take a damn good young player to fetch Carter, certainly a player no team will want to part with.

Look for San Jose to make a major move this off season...another season gone by...another season with the same results. Joe Thornton is on my wish list for the leafs ...realistically the Sharks will try and move Marleau and Heatley...i think both may be gone if there are any takers.



yeah Thornton was a force in the playoffs by far the sharks best player, i don t think they will be looking to move him the year he finally got the monkey off his back ,, its kinda hard if you re san jose another year with the same result but really lets face it they are up there every year and what player is the problem really?

"I led the league in "Go get 'em next time." - Bob Uecker
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4607 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  20:20:30  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here's another guy that just might be available to the Leafs from Philly: Ville Leino, the young LW that had that awesome rookie playoffs a bit more than a year ago.

If I were Burke, I'd take a good long look at him too. Might even be just as good . . . well, almost as good as getting a center like Carter. He is more of a set-up guy, and skates hard, and would probably look good with Kessel. Then of course you'd probably have to put an acquired centre on that top line, or go crazy and put Kadri on the top line (not going to happen, I'd say) as you wouldn't want to split up that Grabovski/Kulemin/MacArthur line, one of the better 2nd lines in hockey, and Toronto's strength really.

Philly needs to clear 5 mil more to fit Bryzgalov in, even with the higher ceiling. Leino will be a free agent this year, and Philly reportedly might look at moving Carle too.

Hey, there's your puck moving defenceman! Not a superstar, but serviceable.

Pick up Leino and Carle (sign Leino, obviously) and give up our late first rounder (pick #30), second rounder next year, and perhaps Matt Lashoff (young d-man almost NHL ready).

There ya go.

Then we still need a first line centre perhaps, but the pressure to sign/trade for a big name is off with a quality player in Leino to play with Kessel.

just another possibility. If I were the Flyers, I would do everything I could to keep both Leino and Carter, but those are the players being rumoured to move, so . . . there ya go.

Now if Philly was willing to part with Briere and his large contract, then Toronto has a real top line. But no word on him moving, so I'll keep that to dreaming.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3598 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2011 :  21:19:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:

Here's another guy that just might be available to the Leafs from Philly: Ville Leino, the young LW that had that awesome rookie playoffs a bit more than a year ago.



Leino is available to everyone - he's UFA in 10 days, and while PHI might trade his rights to someone, I would not be surprised to see him test the market. He's coming off a great year and will probably try to capitalize on that. Burke is not the kind of person to pay for "one-hit" seasons, and as good as Leino looks going forward, thats all he's had so far - one good season. But someone is going to pay him I think.
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Guest2712
( )

Posted - 06/22/2011 :  05:18:46  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

And Colbourne has done what, exactly, to make him so valuable??

Carter has done 60+ points and 30+ goals playing on the 2nd line in Philly! Those are the numbers that Phil Kessel puts up on the 1st line. I think Carter is absolutely the real deal and I would give up 2-1st round draft picks for him.

Without much thought either.



well he hasn't done anything yet, but historically trading away top prospects has been one of the downfalls of this franchise.

didn't realize he's 2nd line in Philly. i thought he was top line. my mistake. don't watch the Flyers very much.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4607 Posts

Posted - 06/22/2011 :  05:54:33  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan

quote:

Here's another guy that just might be available to the Leafs from Philly: Ville Leino, the young LW that had that awesome rookie playoffs a bit more than a year ago.



Leino is available to everyone - he's UFA in 10 days, and while PHI might trade his rights to someone, I would not be surprised to see him test the market. He's coming off a great year and will probably try to capitalize on that. Burke is not the kind of person to pay for "one-hit" seasons, and as good as Leino looks going forward, thats all he's had so far - one good season. But someone is going to pay him I think.



Oh, I must have misinterpreted the site I looked at, I thought he had a year left and was then UFA, my bad.

You're right, Philly will probably have to let him test the market, unlikely they can fit him in. And he would certainly be a target for the Leafs, I'd think. But I would take the "he's only shown us one year" thing along with last year's playoffs as well, for me that's a year and a half's worth. Yes, he was playing with some talented forwards . . . but he has shown that he can skate with the Brieres of the world.

I'd grab him.

Now that I am thinking more clearly (that Bobby Clarke comment was something written while I was in my hottub time machine), I think the Leafs should keep Leino as an option to sign if they lose MacArthur through arbitration.

Because realistically, MacArthur is probably a bigger risk to repeat his season than Leino is to repeat his. Although, you don't often find the kind of chemistry MacArthur had with Grabo and Kuli, so my first thought is keep MacArthur - but not at any price, and Burke is stubborn about price at times.

FYI, Burke has reportedly put quite a few "lines in the water" . . . he is open to trade the Leafs first and 2nd round pick this year to move up in the draft; he is open to trading both first rounders for a centre; and he has said that almost no one is safe, depending of course on what is offered, so he is looking at all kinds of trade possibilities, with a number one centre being the primary target. And, he has said he'll try to act earlier rather than later.

I think we might see a big move or two come July. Who knows what might happen, but we'll keep guessing, of that you can be sure!

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Guest2712
( )

Posted - 06/22/2011 :  07:58:07  Reply with Quote
personally i don't think you'll see MacArthur in a Leafs uniform next season. my bet is on Kadri to replace him on the 2nd line.

assume he is targetting Leino, and he's projected as a winger on the top line. that makes Lupul expendible. would Burke risk packaging Lupul in a trade on draft day before free agency starts on the 1st? i'd have to guess that if it's involving a deal to get a top line center then he'd do it in a flash.
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leafsfan_101
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1530 Posts

Posted - 06/22/2011 :  08:04:33  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The Leafs most pressing issue is depth down center. Just as a side note, I don't think that Kadri will be laying center next year, or in the future for that matter. He excelled as a winger last season, and I think that's where he's going to project next year.

I don't think that the Leafs need Jeff Carter tbh. Carter is a shoot first, gifted scorer, but a 1st line of him, Lupul and Kessel doesn't work. As mentioned, Brad Richards makes PERFECT sense to be in a Leafs uniform next season. I'm not saying its for sure, and it is unlikely given what Richards has said, but I cannot think of a more perfect 1st line guy who can play effectively in every area of the ice. I think that there is a very real possibility Richards is in the blue and white.

As a whole, the defense has improved. While they do need a puck mover and a PP guy like they had in Kaberle, I don't think it is a main priority. Phaneuf does an ample job of moving up the puck, as does Gunnarsson. Looking at the Boston Bruins, the most recent Cup Champs, Kaberle sure didn't add a lot of success to their powerplay, and it is arguable that they had a legitimate PP QB (Seidenberg maybe). PP QB is overrated, most clubs don't need one to have a successful PP, although I would be ignorant in saying it is of no help at all. I am am saying, however, that it should not be a priority.

Fix the Special Teams (which has taken a step in the right direction by firing the Assistant Coaches) and rely on the stable goaltending of Reimer, and the Leafs have an opportunity of seeing hockey late in April.
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8190 Posts

Posted - 06/22/2011 :  08:55:21  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
A PP QB if over rated?? Really.

Let's talk about PP for a second. The top 5 PP teams in the NHL were VAN, SJS, ANA, CHI, and DET in that order. All of them playoff teams. Two of them Conference finalists and one of them a Cup finalist.

Now, let's look at the 5 worst PP's in the NHL. They are FLA, NJD, CBJ, EDM, and NASH. 3 of them are lottery teams, 4 are picking in the top 10 and only one made the playoffs.

Now, take a look at the primary PP-QB on each of those teams.

Van -Ehrhoff
SJS - Boyle
ANA - Visnovsky
CHI - Keith
Det - Lidstrom

FLA -McCabe until the deadline then Wideman
CBJ - Tyutin
NJD - Greene
EDM - Whitney for 30ish games, then Gilbert
NASH - Weber


Do you see a trend there??? Is it a coincidence that the primary PP-QB on the best 5 PP's in the league were also 1st, 2nd, 4th, 7th, and 17th in PP scoring for defensemen??

It takes more than a PP-QB to make a PP successful but it is a big part of it. Not over-rated in the least.
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willus3
Moderator



Canada
1948 Posts

Posted - 06/22/2011 :  09:21:55  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Wouldn't surprise me to see Hamrlik signed.
If he's committed to his fitness and still has drive to play he could be a great fit. Paired with Phaneuf, as playing with Hamrlik is when Phaneuf had his most productive seasons. They fit well together.
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5810 Posts

Posted - 06/22/2011 :  10:00:04  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Interesting Willus. But i did just read that the Habs will offer Hamrlik a contract and that he'd like to stay there. At 37, his days are numbered but as a 5/6 dman in Montreal, i think they'll look at him. Will Burke overpay for a guy to play top pairing with Dion when he's considered a 5/6 in Montreal?
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4607 Posts

Posted - 06/22/2011 :  10:56:11  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hmm, good point on Kadri in all probability moving from centre to wing. It certainly does change things, and makes it easier to plug him into the top two lines (if he has a good camp, obviously) by replacing a potentially departed MacArthur with Kadri.

Then we just have a top centre position to fill, and Bozak moves down to where he should be, on the third line as a defensively responsible checker.

Quality centres we could get through trade / signing:

1) B. Richards (UFA)
Probably the player that most perfectly fits what we want, but he'll ask for a lot, and has reportedly said he doesn't want to go to Toronto. Still, it's not like the Rangers have tonnes of room to sign him, and he could just be posturing. Speaking of posturing, Burke let slip that he has changed his mind somewhat on long term contracts . . . is that for Richards' benefit?

Possibility: 38%. He will be pursued heavily by Burke, and the market to take his contract is small. He has publicly said he isn't going to Toronto . . . could be a bluff though.

Fit: Nearly perfect, if not for his age and concussion issue from recent years.

2) Jeff Carter (PHA)
He has reportedly been shopped by the Flyers, who will be in serious need of shedding salary if/when they sign Bryzgalov - even with the increase in cap, they need to clear 5 mil. He is a legitimate top line centre with scoring skill and grit.

Possibility: 29%, rises to 38% if B.Richards is picked up by another team first. He will be heavily pursued by everyone, but Burke does have pieces to deal back to Philly that are cheap (picks, prospects), the only thing is getting a deal done, and Philly may not want him to stay in the East.

Fit: Not too bad - he's a top line player, who may or may not mesh well with a Kessel on the top line. He's gritty though, and excellent on the pk, so that might push him into "pretty good" territory.

3) Mike Richards (PHA)
I know, I know . . . it would take a lot to trade a guy who is almost a franchise-type player, who is young, can do it all, and is their captain. BUT . . . Bryzgalov contract will be huge, they have serious cap issues, and there has long been a reported rift between M.Richards and the coach - they don't even talk, supposedly. And this came to a head in the playoffs, where Pronger repeatedly butted heads with the captain.

Possibility: very slim . . . 4%? 5%? Still, where there is a tiny wisp of smoke . . .

Fit: almost perfect, close to 100% perfect fit. He is a great playmaker for our top sniper (Kessel), he is a tough, gritty player, a leader, plays very responsible in own end, great on pk . . . everything you want, basically.

Which is why he may never move from Philly!

4) Jason Spezza (OTT)
Rumours are that he is available for the right price, as Ottawa rebuilds and explores all options. However . . . it IS Ottawa, and they sort of don't like us. And, they may be asking for too much.

Possibility: Slim, just because it's Ottawa, maybe 7%. Scratch that, since Burke probably wouldn't pursue him, 2%.

Fit: Quite good. He's not physical, not known fir his defensive responsibility, but . . . he can be a top notch playmaker, and could make Kessel a 50 goal man if there is chemistry.

5) Lecavalier (TB)
He's also rumoured to be available, because he's not the same Lecavalier that was once playoff MVP, and because of cap trouble for TB. May be overpriced for a diminished returns guy though.

Possibility: 4%. Not likely, really, as he is much more likely to stay put in TB unless Yzerman gets an offer he can't refuse.

Fit: Ok I suppose . . . but far from perfect. He's slower than he used to be, still has high end skill, but has shown long periods of looking ordinary. Needs a playmaker more than IS a playmaker, so not sure how he'd be with Kessel. Could be a bust if he landed in TO.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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