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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
 Posted - 07/03/2011 : 19:50:46
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well, a deal I didn't see coming in any way shape or form, SJ trades Heatley to MIN in exchange for Havlat. Player-wise, I think this one goes to MIN - even a diminished Heatley is a better producer than Havlat. However, Havlat is a 2.5M lower cap hit than Heatley, so this gives SJ some cap space to sign other players.
Still, big moves for SJ this offseason, losing Heatley and Setoguchi will probably show next year.
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MrBoogedy
Rookie
Canada
195 Posts |
Posted - 07/03/2011 : 21:10:20
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| wow |
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Guest5483
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Posted - 07/03/2011 : 22:29:23
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| coming from someone who has watched every game the san jose sharks have played for the last 3 seasons...THANK GOD Heatley is gone |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2011 : 07:02:56
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Hmm, if you watched every game for the past 3 seasons( assuming 08/09 ,09/10, 10/11 I would agree that Heatley completely sucked for the Sharks in 08/09. That is because he was in Ottawa!! Dany Heatley played 2 seasons for the Sharks, not three.
Nux you are dead on. Even off pace, Dany Heatley is a dangerous goal scorer. He is coming off the worst year he has had since he was a rookie with 26 goals and I personally don't think we will see a repeat of that. Before last season, he had 5 straight 30+ goal seasons including a 41 goal and 2-50 goal seasons. He is 30 years old and I know from what I believe Slozo posted, most goal scorers begin to decline at 30. However, I still think Heatley has a few high 30's and maybe even low 40's in his bag. In Minny, he will be 1st line even strength and 1st line PP. Possibly even 2nd line PK, so he will get all the ice time he needs to produce.
I am also a fan of Havlat, however this deal is in favour of Minnesota. Even thought the $7.5 million cap hit is high for Heatley, it is well within Minny's cap room. Including Heatley, they are at $51 million. Not only this, think about Minny's top 6 of Heatley, PM Bouchard, Kouvi, Setoguchi, Cullen, and Miettinen (if he signs). That is comparable to most top tier teams in the NHL.
Fletcher is doing ok with that squad. |
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Guest4312
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Posted - 07/04/2011 : 07:38:02
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| heatley wasn't getting it done in the playoffs with 5 goals in his last 36 games.... i like the trade for both teams and think havlat will play awesome next year with SJ |
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Guest4178
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Posted - 07/04/2011 : 08:40:31
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Interesting deal.
Can someone explain why Heatley would be okay to go to Minnesota, but not Edmonton? As most people will recall, Heatley wanted out of Ottawa last year, and he was very selective on which cities he would agree to be traded. A trade was made with Edmonton (or almost made), and he refused to play in Edmonton.
How is Minnesota better than Edmonton? The weather is almost the same. (Well, that's a bit of a stretch, but Minnesota is no San Jose.) As far as the future prospects of the teams, I think most players (like the recent signings the Oilers made) would agree that Edmonton is in a rebuilding mode, and the prospects for the future are very good. (And very exciting.)
Minnesota has missed the playoffs the last few years, and finished 12th in the Western Conference. I don't think their prospects of making the playoffs next year are that great, or that great the year after.
But maybe Heatley's no-trade (or limited trade) contract did not exclude Minnesota? They have a big mall there after all. Wait a minute – so does Edmonton.
Maybe the poor guy just wanted out of Canada, after realizing the spotlight is very large in Canadian NHL markets. I don't like to bring up the past, but Heatley is a guy who just seems to want to get out of town when the going gets tough, like he did in Atlanta.
To be fair though, his first NHL trade (Atlanta to Ottawa) may not have been his idea, and maybe he had no role in this most recent trade?
I don't really know what kind of guy (or teammate) he is, but there's something about Heatley which makes me wonder! |
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sahis34
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
591 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2011 : 12:08:17
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| San jose has made it to the conference finals both years heatleys been in san jose, while before they never made it past the 2nd round |
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just1n
PickupHockey Pro
282 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2011 : 12:47:54
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| I was wondering if he had a no-trade clause as well...? Not anymore? |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2011 : 14:20:14
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| Interesting trade indeed...i like it from both ends. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2011 : 15:29:50
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According to thestory posted on TSN.ca, Heatley has a limited no trade clause which stipulates he must list 10 teams he would not want to get traded to by July 1st. Minnesota was not on the list so away he goes.
I am surprised that Minnesota was not on that list as that does not seems to be a place that Heatley would be interested in after asking out of Ottawa and nixing Edmonton. But who knows. All I know is that Minnesota has quitely become a good team who will push Vancouver in the NW and likely gain a playoff spot this coming season. |
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Guest4312
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Posted - 07/04/2011 : 15:40:57
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| im not sure heatley, setoguchi, some good draft picks, and prospects really make the wild a playoff team... the west is pretty much ....columbus might squeeze in if they can play well with the new additions and that leaves me to believe phoenix would be dropping out |
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Kirby
Top Prospect
Canada
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2011 : 18:14:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest4178
Interesting deal.
Can someone explain why Heatley would be okay to go to Minnesota, but not Edmonton? As most people will recall, Heatley wanted out of Ottawa last year, and he was very selective on which cities he would agree to be traded. A trade was made with Edmonton (or almost made), and he refused to play in Edmonton.
How is Minnesota better than Edmonton? The weather is almost the same. (Well, that's a bit of a stretch, but Minnesota is no San Jose.) As far as the future prospects of the teams, I think most players (like the recent signings the Oilers made) would agree that Edmonton is in a rebuilding mode, and the prospects for the future are very good. (And very exciting.)
Minnesota has missed the playoffs the last few years, and finished 12th in the Western Conference. I don't think their prospects of making the playoffs next year are that great, or that great the year after.
But maybe Heatley's no-trade (or limited trade) contract did not exclude Minnesota? They have a big mall there after all. Wait a minute – so does Edmonton.
Maybe the poor guy just wanted out of Canada, after realizing the spotlight is very large in Canadian NHL markets. I don't like to bring up the past, but Heatley is a guy who just seems to want to get out of town when the going gets tough, like he did in Atlanta.
To be fair though, his first NHL trade (Atlanta to Ottawa) may not have been his idea, and maybe he had no role in this most recent trade?
I don't really know what kind of guy (or teammate) he is, but there's something about Heatley which makes me wonder!
At the time of the akmost trade, the Oilers weren't in rebuild mode. There was no Hall, not sure if they had drafted Paajarvi yet, Eberle had yet to pull off his heroics in the World Juniors if I'm not mistaken, and it was at a time where almost nobody wanted to stay or come to Edmonton. They were a team that had little hopes of ever comepeting in the playoffs on their current track. After that whole mishap and the terrible season that followed was when the rebuild truly began and the Oilers started stockpiling some decent prospects
A good hockey player plays where the puck is. A great hockey player plays where the puck is going to be. -Wayne Gretzky |
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Guest5052
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Posted - 07/05/2011 : 09:32:50
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I was surprised that 65% of the callers on one hockey show (Thats Hockey, I think) said that they would prefer Havlat than Heatley.
I like that Minny made this move. It has some risk to it; that Heatley's best days are behind him and questions about his work ethic.. and big salary. But they had the cap room to make this gamble and he does have a great upside.
they have some good players for him to play with not as good as in Ottawa or SJ mind you... that will be interesting. As good as Koivu is, he is not as good an offensive player as Marleau/Thornton or Alfreddson spezza,so heatley has had some nice line mates over the years... and to his credit he's done extremely well with them.
Also Havlat does have great skills, but lacks consistency and has had huis share of injuries. He may well turn out to be the better assets (and $2m cheaper) but I like Minny's gamble here. |
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Guest4312
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Posted - 07/05/2011 : 09:49:28
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| i would take havlat over heatley any day |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2011 : 10:54:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest4312
i would take havlat over heatley any day
Why is that?? Because Havlat is such a better player?? Because of all the garbage people spew about him being a fungas in the dressing room?? Because you don't like to win??
Heatley has succeeded in most every place he has played. I say that as Ottawa nor San Jose enjoyed the success they had with Heatley before he arrived. He is a perienial pick for just about any International Team and often plays on the 1st or 2nd line Internationally.
Havlat, as good of a player as he is, is not as good as Dany Heatley. He is not a complete players like Heatley in that Havlat is not a defensively sound player who would play on the PP. Havlat has never cracked 30 goals or 80 points. Heatley has averaged a PPG for his career.
The one negative about Heatley is that his work ethic appears to have dropped in the past few seasons. I am not sure which Dany Heatley will show up in Minnesota. If it's the half-a$$ed effort Heatley, the deal would be a draw based on the players production but would be a win for SJ as they saved cap money. However, if the full effort Dany Heatley shows up for Minny, they win this trade. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2011 : 11:22:03
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quote:
i would take havlat over heatley any day
I think the bitterness felt towards Heatley since the Ottawa debacle is colouring opinions. I don't think Heatley or Havlat are the types of characters you want leading your dressing room and I'd be surprised if either have that opportunity in their new cities.
But when it comes down to pure hockey skills and what a player brings to the table, I believe that most GM's would take Heatley over Havlat. For all the reasons that beans mentioned, Heatley is the better overall hockey player. I think MIN won this deal based on the skills, and that a change of scenery will light a fire under Heatley's a$$ this coming season - we're going to see the Heatley of old I think, and MIN did a good job of buying an asset when value was at a low. Meanwhile in SJ, you'll see the same old Havlat, which is just an above average one-dimensional sniper. |
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leigh
Moderator
Canada
1755 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2011 : 15:21:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4312
i would take havlat over heatley any day
Why is that?? Because Havlat is such a better player?? Because of all the garbage people spew about him being a fungas in the dressing room?? Because you don't like to win??
Heatley has succeeded in most every place he has played. I say that as Ottawa nor San Jose enjoyed the success they had with Heatley before he arrived. He is a perienial pick for just about any International Team and often plays on the 1st or 2nd line Internationally.
Havlat, as good of a player as he is, is not as good as Dany Heatley. He is not a complete players like Heatley in that Havlat is not a defensively sound player who would play on the PP. Havlat has never cracked 30 goals or 80 points. Heatley has averaged a PPG for his career.
The one negative about Heatley is that his work ethic appears to have dropped in the past few seasons. I am not sure which Dany Heatley will show up in Minnesota. If it's the half-a$$ed effort Heatley, the deal would be a draw based on the players production but would be a win for SJ as they saved cap money. However, if the full effort Dany Heatley shows up for Minny, they win this trade.
Beans, I agree 100% with every word of this post. Maybe the first time ever  |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2011 : 16:57:53
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| For what it's worth, i'd take Martin Havlat over Dany Heatley as well. |
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Oilearl
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
268 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2011 : 18:19:39
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| I'm for Heatley over Havlat if it's my choice to make. This is based on skill set and what the player can contribute to the teams success. Beans you are 100% correct in your post IMO. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2011 : 18:33:13
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quote:
Originally posted by ryan93
For what it's worth, i'd take Martin Havlat over Dany Heatley as well.
Not that anyone can't have their own opinion, but I am interested in why?? Why Havlat over Heatley?? What does Havlat do that Heatley doesn't?? What makes Heatley less appealing. |
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Kirby
Top Prospect
Canada
66 Posts |
Posted - 07/05/2011 : 19:57:27
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As an Oilers fan I'd take Havlat because Heatley doesnt want to come here and I'm sure we no longer want him. If I'm thinking as any other team though outside of Ottawa, it's Heatley. He can be a great player with the right motivation, and few can score like him. I can't say the same about Havlat
A good hockey player plays where the puck is. A great hockey player plays where the puck is going to be. -Wayne Gretzky |
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Guest4312
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Posted - 07/06/2011 : 09:16:42
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heatley 11/26 goals were on a strong san jose powerplay... indicates he plays well with good players
havlat 3/22 goals on the powerplay... obtains most of his points on his own from hard work and individual efforts.
havlat can be a 30 -40 goal scorer with the sharks this upcoming season... heatley will be lucky to score 25 next year with little to no help i guarantee he becomes invisible on the ice. |
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99pickles
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
671 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2011 : 11:24:43
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| That's a good point that teams seem to have their best success when Heatley is a member. Add that to the fact that Havlat is so injury prone and I think I have my answer....I would prefer to have Heatley than Havlat. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2011 : 13:03:27
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quote:
havlat 3/22 goals on the powerplay... obtains most of his points on his own from hard work and individual efforts.
ah, yes.... I recall all the plays-of-the-day last year that featured Havlat streaking out from behind his own red line, throwing off defenders enroute to the net before backhanding the puck over the goalie's shoulder into the net with one hand on his stick, while his teammates skated around watching.
Oh wait...no I don't. |
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Guest4312
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Posted - 07/06/2011 : 15:11:33
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| sick joke. |
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Guest4312
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Guest0351
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Guest0351
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2011 : 07:32:33
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Really?? We are going to start posting break away goals???
How about this one. This is an entire shift. Heatley is #15 on the bottom of the screen. Watch him the whole play. Not only back checking and playing responsible defensively in his own end but then skating down ice and finding the right lane to the net to find himself wide open for a goal.
Find me one where Havlat does this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VvY9B6Aearo
No one is denying that Havlat is a good player. Maybe even a great offensive players. But Dany Heatley and Havlat both at the top of the their game and it's no contest. Heatley has to come down a step to be compared to Havlat. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2011 : 18:12:50
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Very surprising trade in a lot of ways. Not surprising that Heatley was traded, in my mind . . . and not surprised even that Havlat was traded - I could see both happening. But not one for the other.
Martin Havlat
In Minnesota, a team that most people clearly do not watch had an underperforming star in Havlat - known to be a great talent, had some awesome years, now thought to be inconsistent and perhaps lazy at times.
Best year: 08/09, 29g, 48a, 77 points. Has scored over 30 goals once (31 in 03/04) and over 40 assists twice (40 last year, 48 in 08/09).
Last Year: 22 goals, 40 assists, 62 points.
After 3 injury-riddled years, has played three straight years of 73 games or more.
Dany Heatley
Played for the perrenial cup contending Sharks last two years. Known to be a great talent and twice 50 goal scorer, now thought to be inconsistent and lazy, maybe even a malcontent. Coming off worst season stats-wise, and San Jose seems to have found a younger "replacement" in Couture.
Best year: Scored back to back 50 goals even in both 05/06 and 06/07, had 50 goals and 55 assists for 105 points in 06/07.
Last Year: 26 goals, 38 assists, 64 pts.
JUDGEMENT:
Heatley in a walk, folks.
Heater may not be my favourite guy, but c'mon - his worst ever year so far is average for Havlat. Havlat has never gotten 80 points, and Heatley's high end is over 100. Now, no one is saying that Heater gets there again . . . it's unlikely as hell. But 80 points is probable. With Havlat, you have a bit more of a playmaking-type guy, except that he doesn't measure up to Heatley in the assist department either.
And Heater is way more durable, going by history.
Look for a resurgent Heatley on a Minnesota team that will surprise, I think.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 07/11/2011 : 09:30:42
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Whew.....been away all last week on a trek to a buddy's cabin, no internet, little radio, etc. Missed a ton of the FA action and caught up a bit with radio and newpaper but this was one of the most surprising trades IMO!
Even after a bit of an off year, i figured Heatley would fetch a bit more than just Havlat. Havlat's good, but injuries seem to keep him down at times. The salary and limited NTC must have come into play here?
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SJ Heatley dealt to MIN for Havlat 
