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 Why Do We Continue to Support the Leafs? Allow Anonymous Users Reply to This Topic...
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Lee Marshall
Rookie



Canada
102 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  07:38:04  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
1967 was a LONG time ago. Not once since the league expanded from a 1 in 6 chance to win the cup every season have the Leafs achieved a single moment of true glory.

There were odd flourishes. In spite of that terrible old fart Ballard...Jim Gregory and Roger Neilson had a competitive moment...quickly blown up by Fat Harold and Punch Imlach.

Then...miraculously...Steve Stavro, Pat Burns and the crew gave it a close shave...followed by a couple of decent years with Pat Quinn.

But by and large over these past [passed?] 45 years the Toronto Maple Leafs have been anywhere from average to just plain awful. [or worse]

Corporate Canada continues to buy the seats and boxes [along with well to do die-hards]. The average fan might 'luck' into a seat or 2 once every few years. Across Canada and in various spots in the U.S. Leafs fans show up in impressive numbers to cheer on the Blue and White regardless of the venue.

Why?

Collectively...for 4 1/2 decades...they've done precious little to earn our respect, trust or loyalty. They live on ... floating on the forgotten myths of ancient history. They underachieve so regularly that they should be bankrupt and situated in a museum. Instead they make a gigantic profit each and every year...even if they never really cash in on the big playoff paydays.

The Leafs don't deserve us. Why do we continue to support this long lost cause? Why are we so loyal to an organization which so seldom reciprocates? 3,680 games [approx] and counting. Collectively...those of us who still bleed blue and white have to admit something.

We're a bunch of suckers.



Who the cap fits...Let them wear it.

@valanche
Rookie



Canada
240 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  08:52:10  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
better yet why do we continue to talk about them..

66 is > than 99
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4603 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  09:57:21  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
This topic ain't for you, Avalanche dude. It's for Leaf fans.

I support them because they are my home team, my friend - plain and simple. It's my home team, and I grew up with them, and I'm stuck with them, probably until the day I die . . .

. . . or until Toronto gets another NHL franchise and the Leafs continue to give me ulcers.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
899 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  10:09:07  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'd like to think it's simple really, because they are the Leafs, much like Rider nation here in Saskatchewan.

It's because they are your team and as a fan of hockey, and the Leafs in particular, it's what you do as a fan.

We all poke fun at the Leaf fan and their troubles, but in the end, it's a testament to their support that they continue to be fans, even through the lean years, regardless of how long the droughts may be.

As an Oiler fan, I feel some of that pain, but they will still be the team I cheer for, good, bad and otherwise.

The league is full of teams that can't get fan support and the Leafs have an abundance, not a bad thing, IMO.

Good on those Leaf fans who continue to power through their disgruntlement, it could be worse, you could always be a Habs fan!

A more fickle bunch of fans is tough to find.
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@valanche
Rookie



Canada
240 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  10:29:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by slozo

This topic ain't for you, Avalanche dude. It's for Leaf fans.




i realise i came off somewhat arrogant. you can see my POV though right? the homecoming stretch leading up to the playoffs i want to come on here and talk hockey and it seems the leafs get all the attention... my boys are playing some great hockey, crosby is back, radulov is days away from hitting trotzy and then getting pummelled, malkin giroux and stammer are playing great, ovie and the caps are barely in the playoffs, rick nash is still a blue jacket, the blues are first in the league, winnipeg has a team, and the race for the last three spots in the west (3rd, 7th, & 8th) is coming down to 6 teams.

what i'm trying to say is there are other great storylines.
hopefully the leafs can be a part of them next season.

66 is > than 99
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8186 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  11:34:51  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Couple of things:

Firstly, Slozo. There is no reason why a non-Leaf fan can not post to this thread. Unless the rules have changed, everyone is welcome to state their opinions as long as they are within the forum guidelines.

To @valance. Although I agree that other story-lines may be more appealing at this time, this one is also valid. If you don't wish to participate, don't. Pointing again to the forum guidelines, post quality or don't bother posting at all.

To the point of the thread, I can not comment on why people cheer for the Leafs as I am not a Leaf fan. However, to sports fans in general, you cheer because you do. There is no other reason for it than that. You might have grown up on the team. It might be the team you parents or grandparents cheered for. They might be the rival of the team your parents or grandparents cheered for. The reasons are endless.

I have a great deal of respect for fans who do not jump ship. There are far too many bandwagon jumpers who cheer for the flavour of the week and switch allegiance more often than underwear. Although I have had heated battle with various Leaf fans on this site, I have nothing but respect for a fan who rides every wave with their favorite team, not just the winning waves.

Like FER, I am an Oilers fan. Granted, I am old enough to remember the glory days of the Blue and Orange so I have had the Cup in the barn in Edmonton. However, it has been a long, long time since the Oilers have won anything. A glimmer of hope during one of the past nearly 20 seasons is nothing. But would I every cheer for another squad?? Not a chance. Not on your life. Even if the Oilers never win another Cup in my lifetime, I will still cheer until I am hoarse. I will still throw things at my TV if the Oilers are wronged by a ref or the other team. I will still proudly wear the silks on ever game day.

Why?? Because I am a Oiler fan.

I would expect that my thoughts on the Oilers resonate with fans of other teams as well, even Leaf fans.
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Guest6786
( )

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  13:09:50  Reply with Quote
FER & Beans.....well said!
Simply put, I cheer because they are my team. There is no other besides them. Not sure how else to put it.
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Lee Marshall
Rookie



Canada
102 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  13:35:08  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The Leafs do, in fact, get A LOT of attention in this forum...as it is, after all, the Toronto forum...and the Marlies don't seem to generate the same passions.

When I lived in Winnipeg between '76 and '83...I adopted the Jets as my 'western' team...first in the WHA and then in the NHL. But I never stopped pulling for the Leafs. In those days when Toronto came to Winnipeg...at least 1/2 the stands were cheering for them. Not in Winnipeg anymore. Those great fans learned the true HARD way what's what when it comes to "your" team.

I guess we Toronto fans didn't go through all of THAT...but this is the next worst thing. 45 years of 90% failure and 10% hope.

The plain truth is...I don't have another 45 years. If I'm lucky I might have 20...give or take. It would be nice to celebrate just ONCE more. The chances of that happening? Realistically?

I'm a sucker.

[and I have no other choice]

It really sucks when the NHL season ends on the last day of the regular season...or with 10 games, or so, to go like with THIS particular campaign. Although I then cheer for the other Canadian teams for as long as they last...I REALLY don't have a 'dog in the fight' and as a result...it's all kind of meaningless.

Who the cap fits...Let them wear it.

Edited by - Lee Marshall on 03/22/2012 13:36:50
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@valanche
Rookie



Canada
240 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  13:50:15  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
cheer for the league or cheer for our nation.
theres a good canadian player on every team.
and apparently even an ontario born player on every team (other than TML)

66 is > than 99
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8186 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  14:48:27  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Lee Marshall

The Leafs do, in fact, get A LOT of attention in this forum...as it is, after all, the Toronto forum...and the Marlies don't seem to generate the same passions.

When I lived in Winnipeg between '76 and '83...I adopted the Jets as my 'western' team...first in the WHA and then in the NHL. But I never stopped pulling for the Leafs. In those days when Toronto came to Winnipeg...at least 1/2 the stands were cheering for them. Not in Winnipeg anymore. Those great fans learned the true HARD way what's what when it comes to "your" team.

I guess we Toronto fans didn't go through all of THAT...but this is the next worst thing. 45 years of 90% failure and 10% hope.

The plain truth is...I don't have another 45 years. If I'm lucky I might have 20...give or take. It would be nice to celebrate just ONCE more. The chances of that happening? Realistically?

I'm a sucker.

[and I have no other choice]

It really sucks when the NHL season ends on the last day of the regular season...or with 10 games, or so, to go like with THIS particular campaign. Although I then cheer for the other Canadian teams for as long as they last...I REALLY don't have a 'dog in the fight' and as a result...it's all kind of meaningless.

Who the cap fits...Let them wear it.




Let's not forget that up until last season there was another team with nearly the length of futility. Before last season, the Bruins last Cup was '72. That story might even be more painful than the Leafs as there were a number of occasions the Bruins played in the Finals or Conference finals only to lose. The St. Louis Blues have NEVER won a Stanley Cup and they were an original expansion team in '68. Their team made the finals 3 years in a row and didn't win the big one. Buffalo was also part of the '68 expansion class and they don't have a Cup.

I'm sure there are other examples I am missing. My point is, Leaf fans are not alone in their anguish.
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5800 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  15:24:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

quote:
Originally posted by Lee Marshall

The Leafs do, in fact, get A LOT of attention in this forum...as it is, after all, the Toronto forum...and the Marlies don't seem to generate the same passions.

When I lived in Winnipeg between '76 and '83...I adopted the Jets as my 'western' team...first in the WHA and then in the NHL. But I never stopped pulling for the Leafs. In those days when Toronto came to Winnipeg...at least 1/2 the stands were cheering for them. Not in Winnipeg anymore. Those great fans learned the true HARD way what's what when it comes to "your" team.

I guess we Toronto fans didn't go through all of THAT...but this is the next worst thing. 45 years of 90% failure and 10% hope.

The plain truth is...I don't have another 45 years. If I'm lucky I might have 20...give or take. It would be nice to celebrate just ONCE more. The chances of that happening? Realistically?

I'm a sucker.

[and I have no other choice]

It really sucks when the NHL season ends on the last day of the regular season...or with 10 games, or so, to go like with THIS particular campaign. Although I then cheer for the other Canadian teams for as long as they last...I REALLY don't have a 'dog in the fight' and as a result...it's all kind of meaningless.

Who the cap fits...Let them wear it.




Let's not forget that up until last season there was another team with nearly the length of futility. Before last season, the Bruins last Cup was '72. That story might even be more painful than the Leafs as there were a number of occasions the Bruins played in the Finals or Conference finals only to lose. The St. Louis Blues have NEVER won a Stanley Cup and they were an original expansion team in '68. Their team made the finals 3 years in a row and didn't win the big one. Buffalo was also part of the '68 expansion class and they don't have a Cup.

I'm sure there are other examples I am missing. My point is, Leaf fans are not alone in their anguish.




Oh c'mon now Beans, you can say it.....The Canucks have never won a cup! And, like the Bruins before last year, they've been to the finals before (3 times now).

Also, the Sabres actually joined the NHL the same year as the Canucks and that was in 1970-71, not '68. I remember, because they drafted Gilbert Perreault while the Canucks selected Dale Tallon at #2, passing, as did 6 other teams, on Darryl Sittler .

For long suffering Leaf fans, look at the way the Canucks started out in the NHL and realize you're not alone! After reading the following "wikipedia" paragraph, it's hard not to think that the Canucks were jinxed from day 1........

The consensus was that first pick in the 1970 NHL Amateur Draft would be junior phenom Gilbert Perreault. Either the Sabres or the Canucks would get the first pick, to be determined with the spin of a roulette wheel. Perreault was available to the Sabres and Canucks as this was the first year that the Montreal Canadiens did not have a priority right to draft Quebec-born junior players.

The Canucks were allocated numbers 1-10 on the wheel, while the Sabres had 11-20. When league president Clarence Campbell spun the wheel, he initially thought the pointer landed on 1. However, while Campbell was congratulating the Vancouver delegation, Imlach asked Campbell to check again. As it turned out, the pointer was on 11—effectively handing Perrault to the Sabres.


Screw you Campbell! I demand a recount! I think Imlach moved the freakin' ball when no one was looking!!!
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Guest4377
( )

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  18:34:27  Reply with Quote
I understand fans who are loyal, and like Beans, I was around when the Oilers won 5 cups in 7 years!

Before the Oilers, I cheered for the Habs, and similar to the Oilers dynasty in the 80's, the Canadiens were the most talented and exciting team in the NHL in the 70's! (No disrespect to the Bruins or Islanders.)

But something changed for me as a fan in the 90's, and ever since. I always admired the best teams and players, and it wasn't always my home town team.

I also realized that the teams and players I cheered for did not display the same level of loyalty I had as a fan. Players usually went to teams which offered bigger and better contracts than the "home team."

Sure there are some exceptions, but most players look out for themselves (and for the most part, I have no problem with that), and it's not just money for the players. Sometimes it's playing for the cup (i.e. Ray Bourque), sometimes it's playing with a friend (i.e. Paul Kariya to play with Teemu Selanne a few years back), and sometimes it's just to get out of town. (i.e. Chris Pronger, etc.). How can I be loyal to "my team" when players (or teams) do not return the favour?

Here's another thing. I have a hard time believing the players on "my" team are all great guys, and the players on all other teams are mostly jerks!

It may be hard to believe (especially for the fans of these two teams), I like the Canucks AND the Bruins. They're both great teams (and for different reasons), and last year's Cup Finals was great hockey!

So here I am today as a bonafide non-partisan hockey fan. Sometimes I envy the Leaf fans (or other home team fans) because I admire their passion and loyalty, especially for a team with a lack of post-season success for 45 years!

But I've become a hockey fan, no better or worse than diehard fans who stick with one team for their entire lives.

One benefit of being a non-partisan fan is that bias doesn't usually interfere with opinions on what happens on the ice. I'm not suggesting that other fans wear rose-coloured glasses, but I'm not wearing glasses at all! (Does this make sense?)

Do I hope my home team does well? Of course, but my "home team" (Edmonton) has very few home-grown players. The Flames have more Edmonton born or raised players than Calgary.

Most hockey people (players, coaches, GM's, etc.) follow the money (or opportunity, etc.), but most fans stick with their "home" team.

I'm not against that, and I definitely understand that, but I just really really like the hockey! And because I'm a hockey fan first and foremost!
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Clatts
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
266 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  19:08:45  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Pick a team and stick with them. I live in Alberta, Im a Flames for better or for worse. I hate the Oilers, everyday no matter what but I still respect their fans. Nothing confuses me more than people who cheer for out of province teams...you can take part in one if the greatest rivalries in sports...pick a side and stick with.

As to the comment above, pick a team man, don't band wagon jump, I know the players can be frustrating but it's the logo on the front not the name on the back that counts.

To Leafs fans, I understand why you cheer. It doesn't matter if they suck you've picked your side and you'll stick with it thick or thin and one day when they lift the cup you will be able to say your a true fan and the feeling will be worth the wait.

"Most of the guys that wear them are Europeans and French Guys."
Don Cherry on Visors
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Guest4377
( )

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  19:21:32  Reply with Quote
Hey Clatts - that's fine you're a Calgary fan, well a Flames fan, because a real Calgary fan would probably only cheer for Calgary born and raised players, no matter which team played on!

I'm a hockey fan, and you're a home team fan, and if you think that makes me something less, that's fine. I don't think less of you, or other home team fans.

I'm not a band-wagon jumper. I just like great hockey, no matter who's playing!

I suppose this makes you a fan of your town (which is fine after all), but I'm a fan of the game! But that's just me!
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5800 Posts

Posted - 03/22/2012 :  21:26:22  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4377

Hey Clatts - that's fine you're a Calgary fan, well a Flames fan, because a real Calgary fan would probably only cheer for Calgary born and raised players, no matter which team played on!

I'm a hockey fan, and you're a home team fan, and if you think that makes me something less, that's fine. I don't think less of you, or other home team fans.

I'm not a band-wagon jumper. I just like great hockey, no matter who's playing!

I suppose this makes you a fan of your town (which is fine after all), but I'm a fan of the game! But that's just me!



Well said! To each their own. At least you're honest about it!
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4603 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2012 :  04:40:26  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

Couple of things:

Firstly, Slozo. There is no reason why a non-Leaf fan can not post to this thread. Unless the rules have changed, everyone is welcome to state their opinions as long as they are within the forum guidelines.


I will answer by repeating back the question that was posed in this topic (my bolds):

Why do We Continue to Support the Leafs?

By very definition of the question, anyone actually answering it directly is assumed to be a Leaf fan.

I alwys suspected, Beans, but still . . . shocking to find out like this.

quote:
To the point of the thread, I can not comment on why people cheer for the Leafs as I am not a Leaf fan.


Oh. So why ARE you commenting in this topic then? Seriously. Why?

quote:
However, to sports fans in general, you cheer because you do. There is no other reason for it than that. You might have grown up on the team. It might be the team you parents or grandparents cheered for. They might be the rival of the team your parents or grandparents cheered for. The reasons are endless.

I have a great deal of respect for fans who do not jump ship. There are far too many bandwagon jumpers who cheer for the flavour of the week and switch allegiance more often than underwear. Although I have had heated battle with various Leaf fans on this site, I have nothing but respect for a fan who rides every wave with their favorite team, not just the winning waves.


All fair points.

quote:
Like FER, I am an Oilers fan.


Uh oh . . . here we go. Yet another Leaf thread hijacked by one of those high and mighty Oiler fans!!!

quote:
Granted, I am old enough to remember the glory days of the Blue and Orange so I have had the Cup in the barn in Edmonton.


Yep, I was correct . . . # of sentences it took to mention the Stanley Cup wins after declaring himself an Oiler fan? 1.

quote:
However, it has been a long, long time since the Oilers have won anything. A glimmer of hope during one of the past nearly 20 seasons is nothing. But would I every cheer for another squad?? Not a chance. Not on your life. Even if the Oilers never win another Cup in my lifetime, I will still cheer until I am hoarse. I will still throw things at my TV if the Oilers are wronged by a ref or the other team. I will still proudly wear the silks on ever game day.

Why?? Because I am a Oiler fan.


Wow, it's a good thing he's stayed on topic here by talking about how . . . hey, wait a second!

quote:
I would expect that my thoughts on the Oilers resonate with fans of other teams as well, even Leaf fans.


Some do, some don't. Personally, I'd rather just be hearing from the actual real Leaf fans on this site for this question. But that's just my opinion.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug

Edited by - slozo on 03/23/2012 04:41:04
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4603 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2012 :  05:42:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by @valanche

cheer for the league or cheer for our nation.
theres a good canadian player on every team.
and apparently even an ontario born player on every team (other than TML)

66 is > than 99



Stuart Percy - Oakville, Ontario
Greg McKegg - St. Thomas, Ontario
Nazem Kadri - London Ontario
Jessie Blacker - Toronto, Ontario
Mike Zigomanis - Toronto, Ontario
Ryan Hamilton - Oshawa, Ontario

All acquired by Burke, btw. Sure, there have rarely been Ontario born players in the starting line-up, and obviously no "key" players in that category, but . . . some of our best prospects are Ontario born.

I fail to see much controversy in that, past the ramblings of an old man in a suit made from curtains circa 1966.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8186 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2012 :  08:21:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote

Really Slozo?? That is what your selective reading deciphered from my post?? An Oiler fan hijacking??? That's rich. Since you did such a wonderful job of picking apart the post into small parts that can be easily misrepresented, let me re-post the portion of my post that held the message I was attempting to convey:

However, to sports fans in general, you cheer because you do. There is no other reason for it than that. You might have grown up on the team. It might be the team you parents or grandparents cheered for. They might be the rival of the team your parents or grandparents cheered for. The reasons are endless.

I have a great deal of respect for fans who do not jump ship. There are far too many bandwagon jumpers who cheer for the flavour of the week and switch allegiance more often than underwear. Although I have had heated battle with various Leaf fans on this site, I have nothing but respect for a fan who rides every wave with their favorite team, not just the winning waves.



Sheesh, that post would make a guy want to step on the head of a man who is drowning. It wasn't an Oiler fan hijacking, it was an understanding and appreciation to Leaf fans, and all other fans, who are not fair weather fans. I can compare myself as an Oiler fan to those Leaf fans who will not ever let their passion die. My message was one of respect but I guess that's a bad thing......

Hopefully my message was correctly received by all other folks on this site and you were the only one to miss the point entirely. I am curious, Slozo, why you felt the need to attack my entire post and turn it into something it was not but didn't say anything about FER who made very similar statements?? Hmmm......
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Clatts
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
266 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2012 :  09:21:52  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4377

Hey Clatts - that's fine you're a Calgary fan, well a Flames fan, because a real Calgary fan would probably only cheer for Calgary born and raised players, no matter which team played on!

I'm a hockey fan, and you're a home team fan, and if you think that makes me something less, that's fine. I don't think less of you, or other home team fans.

I'm not a band-wagon jumper. I just like great hockey, no matter who's playing!

I suppose this makes you a fan of your town (which is fine after all), but I'm a fan of the game! But that's just me!



I don't care what you do, It doesn't make me think less off you I just think if you cheer for the team playing the best hockey, Boston and Vancouver last year, sure your going to be happy with the winner every year but you won't get that payoff of waiting and sticking with a team until they have success.

To the cheer for Calgary Born players comment, I could care less where people are born like I said previous its the logo on the front not the name on the back that counts.

"Most of the guys that wear them are Europeans and French Guys."
Don Cherry on Visors
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mandree888
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
390 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2012 :  10:37:58  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
i too am a fan of hockey. i enjoy the beautifull plays, the big (legal hits), the amazing how did he do that save, and occasionally a fight or two. that doesnt mean i dont want my home town to win the cup and join in on the celebrations with them. Hockey is sport that has a lot of different opinions. it always will be. why do i continue to support the leafs? because i do. no other reason is needed. why does anyone support the team of their choice?? who cares. hockey is enjoyed all over the world. i know people here in ontario that prefer to watch the KHL. (why is beyond me). but that is their choice.
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JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1905 Posts

Posted - 03/23/2012 :  16:35:07  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I get that this is a Leaf Fan question but how does one not respond. I know I am an Ottawa Fan first, but as a Canadian hockey fan who loves post season hockey, I will cheer for the Canadian teams until the end. Should the Leafs join the party I would cheer in this Order

Ottawa
Edmonton
Calgary
Vancouver
Leafs
Montreal

Post season Hockey is of higher quality than In season Hockey in my opinion and I dont always have my team to ride in the playoffs. Ok. Band wagon jumping bad. But post lockout the canadian 6 are doing ok outside of T.O post season wise. What do you cheer for come post season.
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Guest4377
( )

Posted - 03/23/2012 :  18:34:05  Reply with Quote
I kinda get the payoff comment, that sticking with one team your whole life through thick or thin makes the reward sweeter.

As stated, I grew up a Habs fan, and I got to see them win 4 cups in a row in the late 70's. I lived in Edmonton, but when I started watching hockey, there were no Oilers, or they were in the WHA, a league I had little interest in.

When the Oilers moved to the NHL, they became my team, my home town finally had an NHL team. And I watched them win five cups!

I was lucky (?) to live in a city with great success!

When you think about it, the odds of winning a cup (all things or teams equal) are once every 30 years. If you live to be 90 years old, "your" team will win 3 cups if you're an average team.

The Flames are a good example of this average. They have one cup win in 30 years. The Oilers have five. Some teams have a few, and some teams have none the past 30 years, or longer.

What's my point? My point is that if you hang your hat on one team to win the cup, you're going to endure a lot of years of disappointment. I see a lot of hockey fans who live and die by "their" team's success, and sure, when "your" team wins the cup, you can have your own kind of special celebration.

But what's to prevent me from cheering for the best hockey, and when my home town team finally becomes a contender, cheering them on? (Because I'm being consistent after all!)

Does this make me a bandwagon jumper? Perhaps, but no one's going to hurt my feelings by making this comment!


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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4603 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  04:40:27  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Where were all these Oiler fans in their own threads?

I wanna see some introspection on Oiler threads on how many top five picks in each year's draft it'll take until they build a winner . . . and how that's going for them.

Cripes, if I knew this thread was going to be mostly non-Leaf fans piling in uninvited . . . I never would have commented.


"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4603 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  04:40:27  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Where were all these Oiler fans in their own threads?

I wanna see some introspection on Oiler threads on how many top five picks in each year's draft it'll take until they build a winner . . . and how that's going for them.

Cripes, if I knew this thread was going to be mostly non-Leaf fans piling in uninvited . . . I never would have commented.


"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5800 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  07:20:20  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Slozo, wake up! You just don't get it do you? All these guys commenting are obviously closet Leaf fans who just don't have what it takes to admit it like some of you guys do!
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8186 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  07:51:01  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
All it takes for Slozo to not post is to talk about the Oilers??

Done and done. Expect a full-on Oiler hijacking to every thread that Slozo posts in. It's on like Donkey Kong!!
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Guest4377
( )

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  09:12:39  Reply with Quote
Getting back to Lee Marshall's original posting, I invite everyone to re-read his comments, which were well expressed, with passion and frustration.

I get the feeling Lee was around in 1967, the last time the Leafs won the cup, and he's been a loyal and faithful fan since. But he ends his posting with the statement "we're a bunch of suckers."

I could never stick with a team with such a record of futility, but I don't think of fans who do are suckers.

Even the Leafs most valuable player the past two decades, Matts Sundin, didn't finish his career wearing a Leafs jersey. Whether you blame the team or the player, where's the loyalty?

I have one more comment about Lee's very good posting, and it's about the "fans" in the corporate seats. Next time you watch a Leafs home game, take a look at the number of empty seats in the first 10-12 rows between the blue lines, and just after the intermissions.

In my town, these seats are called golds, and they go for $512.00 a pair. I'm sure they're even more expensive in Toronto, and like most modern rinks, they give you special access to a club lounge, etc.

Take a look how many of those seats remain empty, and not just for the first minute in the second and third periods, but for many minutes. In past games, I've seen numerous complete empty rows, and this was when the leafs were in a playoff position.

Granted, every rink has corporate "fans" who are not there to watch the hockey (but just to be seen), but nothing compares to Toronto.

And like Lee stated, the "average" Leaf fan can only dream to luck onto tickets to a Leafs home game. It's a shame really. And it's a real shame that the team with probably the most fans in the world has been without a cup so long (or even been in a cup final), but I look forward to the day when this comes true for the millions and millions of Leaf fans everywhere!
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
899 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  13:22:01  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Holy moley Slozo,

Speaking only for myself, I used the Oilers analogy in a supportive way, to Leaf fans, saying I kind of understand your pain, a bit.

That'll be the last time that happens. Much like my brother from another mother, if it's threadjacking you want, I also can get in on that.

For those Leaf fans who aren't quite as sensitive, what I was trying to say is simply, we continue to support our team,(name purposely not included this time), because they are just that, the team we love to support, good times, bad times, sickness and health, etc. etc.

PS. I think the whole 'it's a Leafs thread, if you can't say anything nice', angle played repeatedly, is getting stale, and only draws more of the ire not wanted, something to think about....

As mentioned, we all can post wherever we want, as long as we stay within the guidelines, why is that hard to understand?

Now somebody start an Oilers thread, oh yeah, apparently that's what this one is turning in to.
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
899 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  13:31:09  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
To Lee Marshall,

Suckers is a bit harsh on yourselves, IMO, frustrated? absolutely.

Such is the experience of a loyal fan, to a team, in a marketplace where the expectations regularly exceed the realities. I prefer to think of the Leafs difficulties, go hand in hand with that, attracting players to that cauldron of high expectation has to have some players wondering if it's worth all the trouble that goes along with playing in that marketplace. Take Gustavsson and Reimer as 2 quick examples, Gods and saviours one year, bums the next.

Just my opinion, but it's not an easy job for Burke, or any GM, to try and build in any other way than let's win now, and that is one of the things that I think hurts the Leafs, year after year.

Those young players that do show any skill, get dissected, good and bad, so frequently, that in some cases, I think it totally disallows them to mature normally as a player, again, my opinion only.

I laud those fans who contiunue to support, and will continue to support, and can only hope they stay the course, as it's better to cheer, than jeer, there's enough of that already.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4603 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  14:58:50  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by fat_elvis_rocked

Holy moley Slozo,

Speaking only for myself, I used the Oilers analogy in a supportive way, to Leaf fans, saying I kind of understand your pain, a bit.

That'll be the last time that happens. Much like my brother from another mother, if it's threadjacking you want, I also can get in on that.

For those Leaf fans who aren't quite as sensitive, what I was trying to say is simply, we continue to support our team,(name purposely not included this time), because they are just that, the team we love to support, good times, bad times, sickness and health, etc. etc.

PS. I think the whole 'it's a Leafs thread, if you can't say anything nice', angle played repeatedly, is getting stale, and only draws more of the ire not wanted, something to think about....

As mentioned, we all can post wherever we want, as long as we stay within the guidelines, why is that hard to understand?

Now somebody start an Oilers thread, oh yeah, apparently that's what this one is turning in to.



I understand what you were trying to do, and know that it came from a good place.

However, as I am sure you have experienced before . . . not every magnamonious gesture that you might think is "nice" and "understanding" . . . is really appreciated by the receiver.

And I have yet to have any of you explain why a direct question to Leaf fans got a bunch of responses from non-Leaf fans? Just kinda weird.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Guest0959
( )

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  16:57:57  Reply with Quote
this is a thread jacking:
GO OILERS GO
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OILINONTARIO
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
814 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  17:19:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Reading the original post, I don't see where it says that the question was posed to any particular demographic. And it is a question that many outside of Leafs Nation have pondered over the years.

'Why do they continue to support the Leafs?'

It's just that Lee, being a Leafs' fan, used the word "we".

Anyway, I, too agree with the idea that the total goal is that much sweeter when you have stuck with a team through the lean times. And it seems that a couple years of unguarded optimism may have come back to sting a few in the ass considering the recent firing of the coach, and unprecedented(?) criticism of the GM.

I am not, nor will ever be, a Leafs' fan, and I don't need to defend that. I do, however, find the Leafs Nation to be an interesting sociological phenomenon. I enjoy reading what the media in Ontario have to say, what friends who are Leafs' fans are thinking, and also what those outside of this sphere have to offer. In opinion form, of course.

There will always be trash talk, but I do think that most here have respect for the faithful of this long-suffering club. I know I do.


The Oil WILL make the playoffs in 2013.
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
899 Posts

Posted - 03/24/2012 :  17:59:52  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Maybe the proper thing to do first and foremost, is ask the poster, if his original post, was rhetorical, or if as Slozo is wont to believe, only intended for Leaf fans only.

If the latter is the case, then you are absolutely right Slozo, any on-Leaf fans have no business giving opinion where it's not asked.

If it's the former, than I would think all should be good as is, no?

Of course if is the latter, may want to take a subject such as that to a strictly Leafs forum, as this one is a wee bit broader than that I believe.

I for one, am finding the thought of any non-Leaf fan contributing to anything considered "Leaf only" threads, to be frowned upon, only adds to the imperious and narcissistic, attitude that contributes to the negativity some Leaf supporters seem to attract and dislike.

Just my 2 cents

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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4603 Posts

Posted - 03/25/2012 :  06:07:44  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by fat_elvis_rocked

Maybe the proper thing to do first and foremost, is ask the poster, if his original post, was rhetorical, or if as Slozo is wont to believe, only intended for Leaf fans only.

If the latter is the case, then you are absolutely right Slozo, any on-Leaf fans have no business giving opinion where it's not asked.

If it's the former, than I would think all should be good as is, no?

Of course if is the latter, may want to take a subject such as that to a strictly Leafs forum, as this one is a wee bit broader than that I believe.

I for one, am finding the thought of any non-Leaf fan contributing to anything considered "Leaf only" threads, to be frowned upon, only adds to the imperious and narcissistic, attitude that contributes to the negativity some Leaf supporters seem to attract and dislike.

Just my 2 cents





And again you think I am coming from a Leafs only perspective? I hold that opinion for EVERY team, dude . . .

If there was a topic called,
"Why Do We Contnue to Support an Oiler Rebuild That Looks Like It Will Continue Forever?"

. . . then I would never comment, myself. I mean, what's to be taken as rhetorical there? It's clearly directed to Oiler fans, and fair enough - bless them for grumbling amongst themselves, don't bother me none.

But with the Leafs - the team that is, of course, the most talked about for various reasons we all know - everyone feels like they have t pile in.

I would wager that for any other team . . . we'd never get an "intrsopective" question answered by so many non-fans.

And I will repeat for the hundredth time: yes, I know the rules, and the rules are the rules - anyone can post on any topic. That's all fair and good and right.

Just don't expect me to not give you stink-eye when you believe yourself to be answering a rhetorical question posed so succinctly and clearly to Leaf fans.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
899 Posts

Posted - 03/25/2012 :  10:45:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Wow, guess I'll be more selective in the threads I respond in.

Seems a little over the top, as far as your whole take on this thread, but okay, no one needs a stink-eye.

I'll not post to a 'We Leaf fans' thread again........maybe.

PS. I'm not sure if I ever said anywhere I wasn't a fan of the Leafs, just moreso a fan of the Oilers....hmmm....wonder how that works.

Ahh well.
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Leafs81
PickupHockey Pro



716 Posts

Posted - 03/25/2012 :  13:35:39  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I thought it was interresting to hear fans from other teams to compare why they are fans.

Like anybody said there is various reasons to be a fan of the team you cheer for, and once you, every season you have that glare of hope and you keep on cheering. Like somebody said, WHEN they will win the cup the victory will be even sweeter.

Right now fans of canadian teams didn't have much success for a while now. A few Stanley Cup finals and one cup in the past 20 plus years.

Also to the guy who said he was a hockey fan and love watching good games, well my friend you should be a Leafs fan, because you're a fan during the regular season and in the playoffs you wouldn't feel bad to cheer for Crosby or Alfredson or any other team that you feel should win the Stanley Cup

There is also many fans that has to cheer for a out of province team as there is not a team in every provinces. just stating the obvious here.

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leigh
Moderator



Canada
1636 Posts

Posted - 03/25/2012 :  14:22:17  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Let me end this very painful debate about who can post. All are welcome to post in any forum on any topic, regardless of your flag! No one is excluded. Respect each other. If you don't like the post you have two options 1) ignore it, or 2) debate it on it's merit. But above all else..........STAY ON TOPIC.
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Guest1451
( )

Posted - 03/25/2012 :  21:30:28  Reply with Quote
Coming from a Minnesota fan all I can say is I feel your pain. I don't want to abandon my team but I have a feeling that they will continue to ice substandard teams unless a significant block of fans do quit on them.
Sad to say but I don't think either of our hockey mad cities will see any change in the business first management approach until either the arena is empty or we get new ownership that wants to win.
Gotta say though, I'm jealous that when a big name comes on the market your team is at least in the conversation. Ours hides behind their "small market," nonsense which may work for the Vikings but for the Wild is just blowing smoke. As far as Toronto goes I have no idea what excuse they could possibly be hiding behind.
Really no surprise that teams that ice four or five NHLers and a bunch of prospects crumble when the playoff race heats up.
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Shepsky
Rookie



Canada
211 Posts

Posted - 03/26/2012 :  05:45:22  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think it can be summed up by saying, that we leafs fans, and ALL other fans of teams, that some haters would say "suck" whether it's always finishing at the bottom, or just never looking like a cup contender, stick by our teams out of loyalty. As said the reward will be twice as sweet if you stick through the nasty, but even still, what are the choices? bail on your team? what is the point in that? there is no law that says you can't like more than one team, maybe you have a hometown favorite, but love watching another team play because they play exciting hockey. I always joke at the end of every season recently that "I'm hanging up my leafs jersey for good" but never do, and never will. I do however, enjoy watching the New Jersey Devils play (mainly just been a huge Brodeur fan most of my life) and usually at playoff time I secretly root for the Devils recently (unless they fall short to, like last year) but when the devils and Leafs play each other, I still have to cheer Leafs. So the answer is, we cheer for the Leafs, year after year, despite never being able to see a home game (one reason why we OWN the scotiabank place when the team plays there) because the alternatives aren't any better. Also, Oil, you seem to becoming more and more of a Leafs fan lately... one in denial though

Every day is a great day for hockey
-Mario Lemieux
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Guest4558
( )

Posted - 03/26/2012 :  08:48:32  Reply with Quote
Leafs fans are easy to make fun of because of the large amounts of 'casual fans' that follow the team. These are the same people who say things like 'wow that Crosby sure is good' when he's been injured/not playing for months.

They couldn't name five current roster players, but still probably own a jersey or two. Every team needs casual fan to survive so I'm not hating, but Toronto seems to have a much higher % of them than other cities.

Among their non-casual fans, you have rabid fanbois who blindly believe their team is within arms length of the Stanley cup every year, even when that viewpoint is ridiculous. (see most of the last twenty years) These are the guys everyone hates, because you can't argue with them.

There are countless examples of people on this very forum saying 'playoffs for sure, maybe sneak a round or two once they're in'. When they will finish in no-man's land once again. When I said this prediction, everyone labelled me a 'hater', when really I was predicting that because the leafs always start off hot and aren't very deep or talented as an NHL team. If you can recognize that your team is verrry mediocre then we can maybe have a serious discussion.
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Lee Marshall
Rookie



Canada
102 Posts

Posted - 03/26/2012 :  10:41:11  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Originally I posted the question to Leaf fans...after all...only *WE* know the reasons why we hang in there...as it purtains to the Leafs specifically. BUT...any fan of ANY team likely has a perspective that can fit in here...if THEY stay on topic.

Bashing the Leaf fans is NOT a response to the question. The Leafs bash us enough. Anything else is just piling on.

Meanwhile we're 13th and stumbling toward missing the lottery as well as the post season. As is often the case...being a fan of the blue and white doesn't deliver a whole lot of dividends. Yet...we soldier on. [and for most of us...we'll continue to do so in spite of reality]

Come on Burke...it would appear you have 1 more year to do something meaningful. So...DO IT!!!

Who the cap fits...Let them wear it.
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