PickupHockey.com - Free Hockey Pools, Office Pools

quote:

---

Originally posted by Guest6196

quote:

---

Originally posted by Beans15

Here's one more little tidbit if info to think about.

The agriculture and forestry industries of Western Canada have been in turmoil for the past few years. Primarily the Beef industry from BSE and the Lumber industry first from the Softwood Tarriffs from the States and then the Mountain Pine Beetle infestation.

The Agricultre and Forestry industries contributed $26.9 billion dollars to the GDP of Canada in 2007.

Now, the Automobile industry contributes only $14.1 billion dollars to the GDP of the country, yet there is huge pressure on the Government for a bailout or stimulus for the auto industry???

I can appreciate that there are troubled times in the East and that it is more than just the Auto industry taking a hit, but where was the help for the poor Alberta farmer who couldn't sell his cattle or the logger in northern BC staring into a forest of dead pine???

---

Now the Oil industry in AB are in troubled times. The bigger the peek the bigger the valley. When you have welders and pipe fitters making more than the accountants there needs to be a economic downfall to get the nation back on track.

As much as I am a Liberal i do believe Harper won the election and should be the PM till 2011.

Also if G.Bush Jr. did not spend the amounts he did for the war the US would not be quite as bad off.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by I´m also Cånädiön

quote:

---

Originally posted by Odin
With regards to the socialism over morality, I agree with that as well. We would rather spend to make everybody happy, rather than doing what is right.

---

Ideology, morality and politics are three separate things. How the majority of people in different countries view left and right politics vary depending on many things. One of these things are the history of respective country. In south america right wing politics do not have a high standing because the USA had the habit of replace the democratically elected left wing leaders with dictators that where loyal to the US. The opposite can be seen in many former soviet states. Having been occupied by the soviets, right wing politics are generally more trusted than the opposite.

The political compass vary from country to country. For instance the Democratic party in the US would be seen as very right wing in some countries.

Personally I believe that taxfunded healthcare and education is a good thing as healthy citizens with acess to education have very few reasons to engage in criminal activities.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Beans15

quote:

---

Originally posted by Guest6196

quote:

---

Originally posted by Beans15

Here's one more little tidbit if info to think about.

The agriculture and forestry industries of Western Canada have been in turmoil for the past few years. Primarily the Beef industry from BSE and the Lumber industry first from the Softwood Tarriffs from the States and then the Mountain Pine Beetle infestation.

The Agricultre and Forestry industries contributed $26.9 billion dollars to the GDP of Canada in 2007.

Now, the Automobile industry contributes only $14.1 billion dollars to the GDP of the country, yet there is huge pressure on the Government for a bailout or stimulus for the auto industry???

I can appreciate that there are troubled times in the East and that it is more than just the Auto industry taking a hit, but where was the help for the poor Alberta farmer who couldn't sell his cattle or the logger in northern BC staring into a forest of dead pine???

---

Now the Oil industry in AB are in troubled times. The bigger the peek the bigger the valley. When you have welders and pipe fitters making more than the accountants there needs to be a economic downfall to get the nation back on track.

As much as I am a Liberal i do believe Harper won the election and should be the PM till 2011.

Also if G.Bush Jr. did not spend the amounts he did for the war the US would not be quite as bad off.

---

Couple of things:

1) Oil in Alberta is no worse than it was 3 years ago. Obviously the price of Oil does have an economic impact, but it's still the cash cow. Alberta is still relatively strong in unemployment and the government is still running in the black so it's not that bad. It's more fear mongering by the media and the oil companies. No growth does not equal a decline! However, if the government is going to stimulate the economy with infastructure, it makes sense to further develop refining and pipelines in the west. Ultimately, if I was PM for a day, I would fund the building of two new refineries, one in Ontario and one in BC. At the same time, Pipeline the tarsands to those refineries and be able to export refined products(at a higher value) to the Asian and American Eastern seaboard. Puts people to work in areas that are hurting today and keeps the viability of the western Oil industry. Sure, I'd have the environmentalists on my back, but I think that people as a whole would not complain too much. If it a choice betwen feeding your family or not, most would choose feeding their family.

2) I agree that Harper won the election and should at least have a shot at running the government. I think that is the thing that put the bad taste in a lot of people's mouth. The fact that the Opposition appeared to be oportunistic in taking power. Give Harper a shot at least at a budget. If that fails, then go back to an election. That seems like the fair, democratic thing to do and what the majority of Canadians can agree with.

3) With or without the war, the Americans would have been in the exact same position. The root cause of the entire "recession" is poor regulations and laws governing the financial sector. It is the lack of credit and the mismanagement of companies using that credit that caused the issue. All other issues are driven from that. These things would have happened regardless of the war. However, the government would have been in a far better situation to help the economy (without digging into the future of the country) without the billions(maybe trillions) spent on Iraq. The fatal flaw with the Iraq War was that once the non-existant weapons of mass destruction were not not found, the US should have gottten the hell out of dodge. They had no reason to stay after that. Saddam was out of power, they had no nukes, they had no reason to be there other than greed and pride. They didn't want another Vietnam on their conscience and they like that black gold under the Iraqi desert.

The Sheep has spoken!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Beans15

I maybe didn't explain myself that well. It's not that the Oil industry is not feeling the impacts of the economy and specifically the low dollar and low oil price. However, the are not feeling the same impacts as manufacturing, retail, or other commodity industries (lumber, mining, etc). Reason being is that the demand will remain stonger for oil than most other comodities(other than food). Energy is still required, even if the economy stinks.

So yes, you are right that people in the oil industry should be uncomfortable. But not as uncomfortable as other industries.

And as I said, the industry is not growing, but not shrinking either. The $100 million drop in spending by Encana and Petro Canada for example still leaves their overall capital spending higher than it was 2 years ago.

No Growth does not mean a shrinking industry, but I can mean a shrinking labour force.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Odin
And that would all be very fine, if the notwithstanding clause (our forefathers had some foresight) hadn't been made into a curse word, thanks to, you guessed it: The wonderful Liberal party of Canada. Wonder where they were when the Parti Quebecois used that exact same clause to take rights away from everyday people.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by ThorntonisTHEMAN

Guest 0965, as much as I REALLY want to get into the socialism vs. morality debate, I am afraid that it is too off-subject from the original topic. So unless I would get a mods approval (Beans???) I will stay away from that for now.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Oilers 4ever
[Harper has lost the confidence of the Conservative party and he should call another election and let us decide.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by I´m also Cånädiön

quote:

---

Originally posted by Odin
And that would all be very fine, if the notwithstanding clause (our forefathers had some foresight) hadn't been made into a curse word, thanks to, you guessed it: The wonderful Liberal party of Canada. Wonder where they were when the Parti Quebecois used that exact same clause to take rights away from everyday people.

---

I don´t know that much about internal canadian politics but feel free to elaborate on the above, sounds interesting.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Guest5679

quote:

---

Originally posted by Oilers 4ever
[Harper has lost the confidence of the Conservative party and he should call another election and let us decide.

---

a new election is the last thing we need, do u know how much it would cost... MILLIONS!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by ThorntonisTHEMAN

Guest 0965, as much as I REALLY want to get into the socialism vs. morality debate, I am afraid that it is too off-subject from the original topic. So unless I would get a mods approval (Beans???) I will stay away from that for now.

However, I would like to talk about the whole "buying an election." Politics, like anything else, is HUGELY affected by advertising! Just like in business, if you have a product that you want to sell, you have to market it. Even if you have a great product, it will not sell unless you make people want to buy it. So yes, politics falls under this as well whether it be Obama, the Conservatives, the Liberals or anybody.
HOWEVER, something that needs to be considered is the media. I guess I can't speak for the rest of Canada but Ontario's media is extremely liberal. Most of the major newspapers around here are liberal. CTV and CBC are both very liberal. Hollywood and all the movies that we see are full of liberalism. We are taught liberalism in schools.

Now, I have always been taught that before you make a major decision, you need to look at both sides of the issue. And this is not happening in our country. If you dare to disagree with the norm you are considered a bigot and unintelligent. I'm not that far removed from high school and in my grade 12 Law class I had to give a presentation on abortion. I was the ONLY person in the class that was against abortion. The Liberal media plays a huge part in how we as Canadians think and therefore it is an uphill battle for the Conservative party in every single election.

Oh ya, and I'm done finals!!!!!!!

"I'm not dumb enough to be a goalie."
Brett Hull.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Guest0965

Love the spin doctors. You are in a coalition if you threaten to take away power from the Conservatives. But if you are willing to prop up a lame duck then you are working with the government.

These political parties especially the PC must pay hundreds of millions for these spin doctors. Maybe it is the same spin doctors that sold the weapons of mass destruction and cigarettes are harmless campaign to the US people.

---