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Alex
PickupHockey All-Star
Canada
2816 Posts |
 Posted - 03/14/2009 : 20:25:44
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You try not to pick biases in anything you do, but I'm sorry guys, this next debate topic is one of the funnest ones out there. And yes, I just used the word funnest.
So, without further ado, I would like to announce that FatElvis will be debating Lunchbox over who is the better player: Crosby Vs. Ovechkin.
Post debate side preferences and orders. In case of ties, Lunchbox gets order, FatElvis gets topic.
Let the games begin!
EDIT Lunchbox, we're waiting for you next post. 
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Edited by - Alex on 04/01/2009 14:29:02
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 03/14/2009 : 21:06:14
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Excellent a fresh topic.....
I am not particular as to which or when so if it pleases Lunchbox,,,,he can choose topic and order....If I had to choose my only request would be order, 2nd, but again not a big deal.....
I look forward to the debate and as my friend Carl, 'the f***** up Cowboy', says....Let's git' er' done!!!
Best of luck! |
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Lunchbox
Top Prospect
Canada
88 Posts |
Posted - 03/15/2009 : 11:32:30
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Feel free to go second, my friend...and as for which side I will take, after (literally) flipping a coin, I will be arguing for Ovechkin.
Good luck!
And just as an FYI, I wont be posting my first argument until Tuesday. |
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Lunchbox
Top Prospect
Canada
88 Posts |
Posted - 03/17/2009 : 16:47:14
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Who is better? Alexander Ovechkin or Sidney Crosby. I believe after careful consideration that the choice is Ovechkin.
Now, the first thing the average hockey fan might do is add up point totals and make their decision based on this. So, being an average hockey fan, that is where I will start. Ovechkin has an NHL career total of 399 points (212-187) in 313 games for an average of 1.27 PPG, while Crosby has a total of 384 points (126-258) in 279 games for an average of 1.37 PPG. Here, Crosby has the edge.
Wait...which side was I arguing for?
I bring up this disparity in PPG totals because it is what many of the pro-Crosby crowd seems to cite as proof that he is better. However, due to the short number of games that both of these players has played, I believe it is a very weak argument. If Darrly Sittler had only played one game in the NHL, and it happened to be February 7, 1976, and then he retired with a 10 PPG average, would he be considered the greatest to play the game, or better than he is now considered? Certainly not.
So, I believe in rating Crosby and Ovechkin, we must take into consideration other qualities. Some people call them X-factors or intangibles, and I believe this is where Alexander Ovechkin has the edge. One of these intangible factors is helping your team win games; timely goals and plays, sometimes called "being clutch." While it is hard to quantify this intangible quality, one statistic I will use is game-winning goals. Ovechkin has ten on the season (34 in his short career), while Crosby has scored a mere three (15 career).
"Aha!" you say, "Ovechkin is a natural goal-scorer and Crosby is a play-maker. He's probably never going to score as many goals as Ovechkin.His statistical strength would be his assists" Well, certainly not in the clutch. When looking at their game-winning points this season (GWG's and assists on game-winners) Ovechkin (10-3-13) still has the edge over Crosby (3-6-9). Ovechkin helps his team win by stepping up and making big plays in the clutch and I believe this helps put him one up on Sid the Kid.
Of course there are other of these unquantifiable qualities which I will discuss, but I will first allow my opponent his rebuttal. |
Edited by - Lunchbox on 03/17/2009 16:48:32 |
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 03/18/2009 : 22:10:12
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I am glad that my colleague got the statistics argument up front and out of the way immediately, as I completely agree, that at this stage of these two superstars' careers, stats are not yet relevent regarding whom is the better player, maybe in 10 years the gap will widen enough.
This leaves us with the aforementioned intangibles to deal with when comparing, as well as, delving into what exactly makes one player better than the other.
Clutch player, in my opinion, is somewhat of a wash, maybe advantage overall to Crosby, as they are both expected to be 'go to guys', for their clubs, and much as Ovechkin may have led the regular season regarding game winning point totals, at last count, Stanley Cup final appearances is still a 1 - 0 rout for Sid. It doesn't get much more clutch than that, especially while carrying the added pressure as being one of the youngest captains in history to be there.
Which brings me to another intangible that Crosby has over Ovechkin, leadership. Ovechkin does indeed lead, but with flamboyance and exuberance, which is fine for the highlight reels, but, in my opinion, takes away from the mature leadership that a team needs for extended success.
Crosby carries his leadership in a much more, again in my opinion, mature fashion, leading by example, and playing both ends of the ice with equal passion and effort. Put the highlights, of which they both have their share, away, and watch both players play the complete game, it becomes apparent quickly, that Crosby is a much better team player regarding his work ethic, with, and without the puck, that's solid leadership.
Another intangible in Crosby's favor, is his ability to make the players around him better, Ryan Malone would agree for about 6 million reasons, Bill Guerin could pass for a perky 35 year-old, and Chris Kunitz is trying to remember when he bought that lotto ticket.
Ovechkin has the luxury of Semin and Backstrom, almost perfect compliments to the sniper, not sure if they need help looking better. |
Edited by - fat_elvis_rocked on 03/18/2009 22:11:36 |
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Lunchbox
Top Prospect
Canada
88 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2009 : 04:03:13
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I can almost agree with you in principal on some of these points, but lets take a closer look.
First, you say Crosby is a better leader, taking away everything else, because of his work ethic and mature attitude. Putting mere differences of opinion aside, I beleive Ovechkin doesn't get enough credit. Watch him for a few games and you see that he plays with more passion than most. He lays out the big hit, he gets almost as excited for a teammate scoring as he does when he scores his own (minus the dancing  ). I think Ovechkin's love of the game is often mistaken for "immaturity" and gets the "selfish" title merely for getting more goals than assists. However, the only reason he isnt the captain (and it was offered to him) is that he wanted to be better at English first. Classy (and mature) move...and when you have a language barrier, all you really can lead by is example, and I believe in that category he goes above and beyond.
You also say that Crosby is more clutch because of the Penguins trip to the Stanley Cup finals. You say this makes it 1-0 Crosby, but I believe that all this does is make Crosby 0 for 1. Getting to the Finals is great, but I dont remember them handing out the big shiny rings just for making it to the show. So, until all those young Canadian hockey players out there start dreaming of hoisting over their heads the Prince of Wales Trophy, we'll have to agree to disagree.
I could also argue on this last point that "Its too soon! Ovechkin could go to the finals twenty times in his career!" but I wont. We can probably both agree that this argument can be used on ANY point either of us make, so imagining Crosby and Ovechkin both decided to hang up the skates to sell more powerade, we must only consider their careers to this point.
Doing this, I can see another "intangible" I'd put in Ovechkin's favor: his ability to avoid injury. Crosby , in his short career, has lost 38 games to injury, a "healthy" (pardon the pun) 11.88%. Ovechkin, on the other hand only lost 3 games for 0.94%.
Given Ovechkin has been able to "stay in the game" more often to help his team, and therefore get more points, and has an equal, admittedly different, leadership ability, I believe he is currently the better player.
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2009 : 14:25:05
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As suggested, let's indeed take a closer look. I'm not sure where the line is drawn between passion and reckless abandonment. Ovechkin certainly plays with the latter, and I'm sure, a lot of the former, but reckless abandonment, while exciting, does not the better player make.
The big hits that pro-Ovechkin fans refer to regularly are an example of just this. Bodychecking is an important component to many hockey player's overall success, if that is the style they choose to play, there are many fine examples of great players, that never made that their forte.
Ovechkin chooses and needs to have this element in his game, to be able to flourish as he does, fair enough.
Does this make him a better player? It self-enhances his ability to take his game to that higher level, without question, but I'm not sure that a Jamie Heward, or Daniel Briere would attest to it contributing to his being a better player than Crosby. A dirty check, is still a dirty check, regardless of stature.
He does indeed have many examples of how his ability to hit, imply the fact that he may be better rounded as a player, but, as an example I just recently saw during some highlights, shows, does running over Marty Reasoner, 2 seconds after he makes a pass, really show better skill, or more recklessness and disregard.
I harken back to my previous points of leadership and maturity, in my opinion, being one of very few factors that differentiate these two young superstars. By now, we have all heard and seen repeatedly, about Ovie's, Terrel Owens like gaffe, and this is another example of how his exuberance and recklessness abandon, blur the lines of passion and determination.
Again, Crosby shows much better leadership and maturity. I'm guessing most players would have better regard for a player that purportedly whines too much compared to one who hits late and rubs goal scoring in your face, just my thought.
You use the intangible of durability as being a nod in Ovechkin's favour. I use your reference to the "It's too soon" argument regarding this point, as easily as Crosby could never get hurt again, as physical as Ovechkin is, he could. Also, the ability to be healthier meaning more use to this team regarding points, at last count they were tied in the scoring race at 96 points, and 9 points apart in the standings with both, currently holding a post season spot. No clear winner here.
I think we both agree that comparing most skill sets between these two is splitting hairs, both have tremendous skills and appeal, albeit used differently. I reiterate that what makes Crosby better is the leadership and maturity, because of this, in this particular comparison, that being who is the better player, Crosby, by a couple extra follicles, is the better player.
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Lunchbox
Top Prospect
Canada
88 Posts |
Posted - 04/01/2009 : 16:14:16
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Well, again we agree on something...comparing these two players is indeed splitting hairs, or comparing apples to oranges. However, I dont quite agree with you on what you say pushes Sid the Kid over the top.
You state that Ovechkin plays with recklessness, and then point to a late hit he delivered. But does this really put a lock on the kind of player Ovechkin is? If you take a look at a tape of almost any players' entire career, you would be able to compile a large "highlight reel" of dirty plays; late or borderline hits, cross-checks, punches, and other immature and reckless activity. And yes, Sidney Crosby could be used as an example.
So I say that any player who has a late hit or borderline-legal play cant be considered reckless, because we would have to include most of the league in that argument. Does Ovechkin's play make him more likely to be involved in this kind of activity? Possibly, but that is the price to pay for playing a more "complete" style of hockey.
You again reference Crosby's leadership, but this argument on closer look doesnt hold much water. A large debate could be had over whether or not Crosby was deserving of the captaincy in Pittsburg. While arguments can be made either way, the issue is certainly not clear-cut. Crosby certainly has more points than his teammates over the past few years, but unfortunately you cant interchange the word points for leadership, so I believe Crosby's ability to captain a team will take more time to tell.
Ovechkin on the other hand, declined the captaincy until he felt he was ready for the responsiblity. Why should this be a point against him? I believe it shows a great deal of maturity on Ovechkin's part. Maturity you say he lacks, pointing to his 50th goal celebration. Now this, much like Crosby's leadership, is not clear-cut. However, I believe that this issue was blown hugely out of proportion, especially by the media looking for a story.
In fact the overwhelming response by most players and staff was "It was funny" or "...no big deal." Even the Tampa coach, before the next game between these two teams, said he only wished it wasnt by the Tampa goalie, but near Ovechkin's own bench. So was Alex Ovechkin being immature based on Geography?
This reminds me of Crosby's issue of rag-dolling Brett McClean. Was it a cheap play? Did McClean agree to fight? No one knows, but some people thought Crosby was immature and reckless there...Players and coaches across the league were asked about it...but for better or worse, a week later no one was talking about it.
However, Crosby was given a much easier time because punching a guy in the head is occasionally "part of the game" where Ovechkin's celebration isn't. Does this make Crosby more mature? Hardly. But these two issues aside(and I put them aside because they are one-time issues) I believe Ovechkin does play with a level of maturity. He knows that his best way to hurt a team is on the score-sheet, but isn't afraid to throw the big hit either. He plays with more tenacity and heart that I see from Crosby, showing that win or lose, a player can enjoy this good old game, and I beleive over an NHL career, this drive coupled with his talent, will make him the greater player.
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/03/2009 : 20:14:48
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I'm beginning to think the hardest part of this debate is going to be finding a point that CAN'T be agreed upon.
These are inarguably the 2 biggest stars of the league for the future, with honorable mention to the Malkins and Kanes of the world. It is this kind of discussion that proves that point. They both bring so much talent, in different capacities and skillsets, that there is no possible way to have anything other than one's own opinion, be their own deciding factor, regarding the unanswerable question of which is the better player.
That being said, I leave this debate, with kudos to my opponent for his well stated arguments and stating his choice in the way he did. I have trouble disagreeing with much of what he stated and find myself being an Ovechkin fan, as well as a Crosby fan, and appreciate both of their individual talents.
I still believe that Crosby, by the narrowest of margins, is the better player, if such a moniker can actually apply, and I break it down to much more basic comparisons.
Offensive skills - This I believe would have to be a tie, Ovechkin being the much more dynamic goal scorer, but Crosby being the dynamic playmaker, both contributing equally to their teams regarding 'pucks in the net'.
Physical play - Ovechkin the clear winner here, but with an addendum. Watch his physical game, the questionable hits, the liberties occasionally taken, and the fact that going for the hit, at times, leaves Ovechkin out of position. I can appreciate the physical game, but it has price, Crosby has yet to end someone's career.
Defensive play - I have not seen these 2 play as much as I would like, but from what I have seen, I would estimate approxiamtely 20 games each, and most highlights regarding the two, Crosby would appear to be a head above. He seems to play with better intensity and responsibility regarding defence. Ovechkin seems to be on the ice for too long at times and somewhat less intense in his zone than he most obviously is in the offensive zone.
Leadership/Maturity - I will gladly concede that Ovechkin is maturing and does indeed show leadership, but as it stands today, Crosby, slightly leads in this category.
As you can see, the difference is negligible at best, but Crosby, by my parameters is the better....barely.
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Alex
PickupHockey All-Star
Canada
2816 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2009 : 17:59:30
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Voting is now open.
It's a hard decision to make, but I'm going to vote for Lunchbox. I think that he did a good job of posting new arguments in each of his three posts and also made some key points in favour of AO. Not to mention a little humour to boot.
Let's go boys, we need a few more votes to give the edge to one guy or another. Let's try to move along so that we don't have a rough time keeping people around come post-playoff time. |
Edited by - Alex on 04/13/2009 20:20:33 |
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hanley6
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
674 Posts |
Posted - 04/05/2009 : 08:27:46
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| I think both Lunchbox and fat_elvis_rocked both made excellent debate which makes my vote very tough, both made very strong points.. My vote goes Lunchbox by a thickness of a pubic hair... Good Job to both Lunchbox and fat_elvis-rocked, you both did amazing |
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Reeder17
Rookie
Canada
112 Posts |
Posted - 04/05/2009 : 10:08:27
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I vote for Lunchbox
For reasons I will keep to myself. Be careful where you open your mouth Fat Elvis
Crosby is not the Lord & Savior of the NHL, get over yourself McGuire.
Gretzky has never once high-sticked a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs. |
Edited by - Reeder17 on 04/05/2009 10:08:54 |
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MrD
Top Prospect
Canada
19 Posts |
Posted - 04/05/2009 : 10:20:07
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Well done gentlemen, excellent debate! This is a tough subject like you two mentioned - it's really early in their respective careers and a lot of the arguments will be based solely on opinion. That being said, I have to give my vote to LUNCHBOX because I could follow his train of thought easier, and found his writing to be more poignant (which helps deliver his stance far more powerfuly). Again, great job both of you.
Milbury and McGuire should fight to the death and both lose. |
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/05/2009 : 10:55:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Reeder17
I vote for Lunchbox
For reasons I will keep to myself. Be careful where you open your mouth Fat Elvis
Crosby is not the Lord & Savior of the NHL, get over yourself McGuire.
Gretzky has never once high-sticked a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs.
Could you let me know...just for interests sake...WTF?..
It would be nice to know what you mean with the 'Be careful...' stuff.
The whole point of a debate isn't to take what we talk of literally as our unheralded belief, it is to evaluate how we each take 'whichever' side of the debate we take, and evaluate the content on how we are able to convey our 'argument' favorably. I'm not sure what your verbage with your vote is implying but it would be nice to know... if you're up to it..
And thanks to the other voters so far...you guys get it, this isn't debating a subject you are passionate about, it's debating a given subject..huge difference.
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ThorntonisTHEMAN
PickupHockey Pro
499 Posts |
Posted - 04/05/2009 : 18:45:13
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| The way these two gentlemen handled this debate was as close as the skills of Crosby and Ovechkin. And although I give Ovie the advantage as being a more complete player, my vote will be with FAT_ELVIS_ROCKED. Great job to both of you though! |
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Leafs Rock Planet
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/05/2009 : 19:08:30
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| Very good debate. For future reference everybody, I think the length of each of the posts were perfect. Both of you argued your respective side well but by a slim margin I give the edge to Lunchbox. |
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hanley6
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
674 Posts |
Posted - 04/06/2009 : 08:53:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Reeder17
I vote for Lunchbox
For reasons I will keep to myself. Be careful where you open your mouth Fat Elvis
Crosby is not the Lord & Savior of the NHL, get over yourself McGuire.
Gretzky has never once high-sticked a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs.
you can't vote for someone because of that... vote on the posts just because you don't like someone doesn't mean they do a stronger debate.. Fat Elvis Rocked did an excellent job. Both Contenders were right on with each other |
Edited by - hanley6 on 04/06/2009 08:59:23 |
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hanley6
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
674 Posts |
Posted - 04/06/2009 : 09:10:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Reeder17
quote:
Originally posted by hanley6
quote:
Originally posted by Reeder17
I vote for Lunchbox
For reasons I will keep to myself. Be careful where you open your mouth Fat Elvis
Crosby is not the Lord & Savior of the NHL, get over yourself McGuire.
Gretzky has never once high-sticked a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs.
you can't vote for someone because of that... vote on the posts just because you don't like someone doesn't mean they do a stronger debate.. Fat Elvis Rocked did an excellent job. Both Contenders were right on with each other
Hanley don't tell me how to post and/or vote. Your a f***. You can't make a post that makes two cents and than state it as a fact. I vote the way I want. Who says it has to do with how much I like a guy?
Crosby is not the Lord & Savior of the NHL, get over yourself McGuire.
Gretzky has never once high-sticked a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs.
I'm a what? hahaha. Alex said before the debate started. Advancing: Once the debate is over, each member votes. This isn't ''which side I like better'' or ''which member I like better'' - it's ''which member debated his side better.'' The winner moves on to another debate on another topic. |
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/06/2009 : 10:10:31
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Please, let's not get into this, as there are other posts already Hanleyjacked....
I only would like to know what Reeder referred to with 'Be careful where you open your mouth Fat Elvis' reference. Reeder can indeed vote however he wants, Hanley.
I still await your reply to my question though Reeder... |
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Reeder17
Rookie
Canada
112 Posts |
Posted - 04/06/2009 : 11:05:22
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quote:
Originally posted by fat_elvis_rocked
Please, let's not get into this, as there are other posts already Hanleyjacked....
I only would like to know what Reeder referred to with 'Be careful where you open your mouth Fat Elvis' reference. Reeder can indeed vote however he wants, Hanley.
I still await your reply to my question though Reeder...
I was referring to what you said in the debate, too bad Hanley has his own [ moderator edit ] non-factual opinions.
Crosby is not the Lord & Savior of the NHL, get over yourself McGuire.
Gretzky has never once high-sticked a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs. |
Edited by - n/a on 04/14/2009 04:38:40 |
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/06/2009 : 11:14:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Reeder17
quote:
Originally posted by fat_elvis_rocked
Please, let's not get into this, as there are other posts already Hanleyjacked....
I only would like to know what Reeder referred to with 'Be careful where you open your mouth Fat Elvis' reference. Reeder can indeed vote however he wants, Hanley.
I still await your reply to my question though Reeder...
I was referring to what you said in the debate, too bad Hanley has his own retarded non-factual opinions.
Crosby is not the Lord & Savior of the NHL, get over yourself McGuire.
Gretzky has never once high-sticked a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs.
Which part? I'm probably misreading your intent, but it sounds a wee bit confrontational? Not sure how many people wouldn't. Just looking for clarification...thanks. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 04/06/2009 : 13:31:27
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Ok, first of all I must stress for people to STOP THE PERSONAL ATTACKS. Personally, I am sick of having to make this same post every single day. This goes to everyone. Stop with the name calling and the off color comments. I have better things to do with my time than to go through thread after thread and remove content. Try to act with a little mature and tacted.
Just like my old Gramps used to tell me, "Treat people with respect and dignaty, even if they don't deserve it."
Now that my moderator hat is off, I give my vote to Fat Elvis. For multiple reason and not because I think Lunchbox did a bad job, I just liked Fat Elvis's approach and arguement better.
And I do think that Ovechkin is a better player, but that doesn't mean that Fat Elvis's arguement was not better.
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Reeder17
Rookie
Canada
112 Posts |
Posted - 04/06/2009 : 13:50:46
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quote:
Originally posted by fat_elvis_rocked
quote:
Originally posted by Reeder17
quote:
Originally posted by fat_elvis_rocked
Please, let's not get into this, as there are other posts already Hanleyjacked....
I only would like to know what Reeder referred to with 'Be careful where you open your mouth Fat Elvis' reference. Reeder can indeed vote however he wants, Hanley.
I still await your reply to my question though Reeder...
I was referring to what you said in the debate, too bad Hanley has his own retarded non-factual opinions.
Crosby is not the Lord & Savior of the NHL, get over yourself McGuire.
Gretzky has never once high-sticked a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs.
Which part? I'm probably misreading your intent, but it sounds a wee bit confrontational? Not sure how many people wouldn't. Just looking for clarification...thanks.
Just in general I didn't mean it to be so confrontational.
Crosby is not the Lord & Savior of the NHL, get over yourself McGuire.
Gretzky has never once high-sticked a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs. |
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/06/2009 : 14:23:50
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Fair enough Reeder, and thanks for replying. Still not sure what you meant as I'm not sure what I may have typed that was controversial but, c'est la vie.
Just a suggestion if I may though, telling anyone to 'watch where they open their mouth', does sound confrontational, no matter what the context, so you'll have to excuse me if it caused me pause. Must be the old coot in me acting up..
Thanks to all who have voted to this point and early congratulations to Lunchbox(unless I pull out an Oiler miracle), that was an enjoyable debate, with kudos to him for presenting his arguments the way he did, I almost stopped and voted for him after his 3rd post myself.. |
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hanley6
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
674 Posts |
Posted - 04/06/2009 : 15:34:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Reeder17
quote:
Originally posted by fat_elvis_rocked
Please, let's not get into this, as there are other posts already Hanleyjacked....
I only would like to know what Reeder referred to with 'Be careful where you open your mouth Fat Elvis' reference. Reeder can indeed vote however he wants, Hanley.
I still await your reply to my question though Reeder...
I was referring to what you said in the debate, too bad Hanley has his own retarded non-factual opinions.
Crosby is not the Lord & Savior of the NHL, get over yourself McGuire.
Gretzky has never once high-sticked a member of the Toronto Maple Leafs.
mmmmm hmmmmmm i see.. You can't even give a clear answer and you lack respect. You did attack Fat Elvis on your vote, not giving a proper reason why you voted against him either than something he may have said to you in the past, having nothing to do with his posts in the debate... The respectful thing to say is [ Moderator Edit - Personal Attacks will not be tolerated. ] |
Edited by - Beans15 on 04/14/2009 03:55:55 |
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hanley6
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
674 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2009 : 13:36:25
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| hey Alex, Isn't it about time to move on to the next debate? no one has responded in a couple weeks |
Edited by - hanley6 on 04/17/2009 13:37:41 |
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Alex
PickupHockey All-Star
Canada
2816 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2009 : 13:58:09
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quote:
Originally posted by hanley6
hey Alex, Isn't it about time to move on to the next debate? no one has responded in a couple weeks
I was asking myself the same question. Originally there was a time limit on each debate and you had to get the most votes from those who voted before that time. I did not mention a time limit on this one and in fairness it would not be right to move on without the right amount of people unless of course fat_elvis agrees to do so (something which I am not requesting you do). So either fat_elvis closes the curtain on this bad boy or more people get their votes in. One of the two. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2009 : 15:12:36
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Why do we have to wait for the vote to finish before we start the next debate??? I would think that if anyone else is going to vote on this, they will do that before the next debate is done.
I say let's rock!! |
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/17/2009 : 22:57:34
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I have no problem giving deserved concession to Lunchbox, congrats, and let's get the next one rolling!
Thanks to those who voted for my diatribes and good luck to the next debaters. |
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Great Debate: Round One, Debate Four 
